Yup, just Kotaku being shit, I mean Quiet's design is garbage but she's meant as an anti-thesis of characters that do dress like that in games.

Do we really have to do this again? I want you guys to know that by even mentioning Kotaku, you play right into the hands. No matter how many times I point out that they're a tabloid that focuses on page views, people still keep going back or like to mention them in every breath.

There's so much "controversy" over video games and it's getting tiring. And it's not even one side. SJW post something on Kotaku, then anti-SJW feed into it and we pretty much have a perpetual shit machine working.

Really, bring interesting video game discussions back to the forefront of the internet and stop focusing on this stuff. Please. I beg you. This is infecting nearly every video game site I visit.

>>180132
NEARLY every video game site? There's one that isn't infected yet? Please tell me of this magical Xanadu!

>>180130
The bikini top and ripped tights IS a pretty shitty outfit, but there's alot more wrong with the MGS franchise than some poor character designs

>>180133

Well /vr/ is pretty good about it. The userbase there works hard to make sure the discussions are pure video games. Unfortunately, the board is only for 1999 and before.

Also the IRC channels I hang on (unfortunately I won't link them here as they're semi-private places for me and my friends)

That's...it. It's sad. I've just had it with the controversy. It's getting in the way of our video game discussion. And as previously stated, Kotaku does this for attention and nothing else. Why the internet has yet to figure this out is simply baffling. Either people are turning on their blinders or they just want to be angry about something.

Also manufactured rage is something else video game communities on the internet need to cut back on.

>>180134
>but there's alot more wrong with the MGS franchise than some poor character designs

Don't let the Cult of Kojima hear you say that.

Meh its rather poor design for desert since bear skin is very bad thing to expose to that environment. But I do enjoy the game of "I want to see how far they'll let me take this." that Kojima plays.

Asking Hideo Kojima to stop being insane is like asking a cat to stop trying to put its face in your cereal.

Stupid name, stupid outfit, 100% MSG-universe relevant. In that universe it seems the men are just as likely to get half naked as women; in fact, gameplay wise, the men tend to dress down even more than the women.

If anything, the fact that she's wearing anything up top means she has more protection than, say, Vulcan Raven (as shown) and will be construed as sexist either because it says that women require more protection then men or that men are not worth the extra protection for their nipples.

NGL: All these news articles that're talking about sexism in gaming... well... I won't say it's unwelcome.

I mean I'm glad we're discussing things like feminism and what merits a good female character. But by the same token...

I'm worried that the only reason this is happening is because social justice and pointing out feminist issues in gaming has become a "trendy" thing to do. And the issue there is that trends are a flash in the pan, talk about it and obsess over it for a couple months kinda thing. Then it goes away and worse, people start to be REACTIONARY over that.

>>180140
It does seem like some kind of bandwagon thing going on. I mean I've never heard this stuff getting mainstream attention

Trying to tell the Japanese to stop being weird is a losing battle.

>>180141
>Index..105%?

>>180144
God that camo system.

Still love 3 the most. Fantastic atmosphere, great music, toned down the crazy bullshit from 2 only to throw in Cold War crazy bullshit. I wish the Cobra unit got a prequel. I mean I can't be the only one who wants to kill Nazis with bees.

I just think she could use more durable clothing.
Those tattered leggings clash so drastically with everything else.

Pardon if this sounds ignorant, but if he wants to write a more serious story, why is he resorting to old tricks like this?

>>180146
Kojima's incapable of not doing weird crazy shit.

how dare those misogynist scumbags slut shame a woman for dressing as she pleases

>>180148
But this isn't her doing as she pleases. This is essentially someone dressing a barbie to their liking.

But if Ken gets put in the freezer half naked, why not barbie into the oven?

>>180149
Because ken actually has a chance of surviving due to simple body mass and the fact that an Alaskan winter would be without sunlight. That and the fact that he's a genetic curiosity even for an Inuit.
The dessert however has higher UV intensity which would tear anyone's skin apart, barbie or otherwise. However, weather or not she proves to be a genetic curiosity like Raven has yet to be seen.

But this is all just dancing around the subject. We all know why she's dressed like that. He wanted an "erotic" or rather "sexy" character. That's pretty much it as far as her design goes.

But if I may be blunt, she's dressed like a dirty skank who ran through an armory. But that's just how I see it.

>>180150
We're talking about a universe with androids, telekenetic powers, cloning, giant mechs, and so on. That kind of logic is sound in our world, but in that world it doesn't matter in the least.

>>180151
>But this is all just dancing around the subject. We all know why she's dressed like that. He wanted an "erotic" or rather "sexy" character. That's pretty much it as far as her design goes.

It's kind of weird to see this and the Shantae thread back to back.

>>180150
Who's to say a dirty skank can't be a good sniper?

Stop slutshaming, man.

Honestly I don't see why people are reacting more strongly to this than they did to the B&B Corps, which was waaaaaay weirder of Kojima.

>>180155
The B&B Unit's first introduction to the world established them as characters much better than any promotional material associated with MGS5 has done for Quiet. There's simply not much to go on besides her clothing and basic role. Everything else can only be guessed at. Ocelot electrocuting her isn't going to score points with casual observers either. The B&B were also absolutely batshit insane right from the get go and I think that disarmed people somewhat. I mean look at this: Metal Gear Solid 4: New Traile… I still think that shit is ridiculous even after all the other things MGS has shown me. You either ran with the layers of weirdness or rejected them outright. Then there were all the other things associated with MGS4 to be talked about instead, like whether it would be on 360, would it even be playable given Kojima wanted to step down, what the hell is happening to Snake, etc.

We also care way more about shit now than we did 7 years ago. I could put that more eloquently, but I don't want to give the impression that everyone who comments on every vidya issue is informed or intelligent. I'm just saying, people are more eager to discuss every little thing.

>>180130
Power Fantasy
Solely Erotic character design.
That's the difference.

>>180159
>NPC characters
>Power fantasies

>>180159
> Power Fantasy
Pretty much all the major characters in the MGS games are power fantasies, Raven included.

> Solely Erotic character design
Kojima has already said there is more to the character going on, that there is a reason for her looks

Say what you want about Kojima, but he knows how to write good females. The Boss, Eva, and Meryl are well developed and complex (at least as videogame characters go) characters, and in Eva's case she is quite sexualized in MGS3 and yet she comes off as a strong coprotagonist.

Why not at least give the guy the benefit of doubt? I can understand being a bit concerned after Kojima's first juvenile comments about Quiet, but why not believe him when he later elaborated on that? Why would Kotaky publish vitriolic bullshit like the pic attached, if not to bait for flames and stir empty controversy?

>>180162
He kind of ruined Meryl in 4.

>>180157
I just can't get over the "oh yeah we had the models do their work naked" or the white room stuff.

I'd ask him to dial it back but for better or worse I think it's best to just let Kojima work unmuzzled. If the result is garbage like 2 and 4, so be it, but hopefully it'll turn out better.

THE RIDE NEVER ENDS

>>180163
> MGS2
> garbage

No

So we can just stop talking about this now that Kotaku is proving they are just creating a controversy for page views right? They are like Betelgeuse, if you ignore them they can't do anything but are very obnoxious.

>>180166
This is the only way we ever get to talk about games I like.

>>180167
Fuck, same here actually....

>>180157
>>Ocelot
Man I am just so sick of revolver bobcat, it got pretty lame by 4 when he was revealed as "ACTUALLY THE GUY WHO ACTUALLY SOLVED EVERYTHING AND HAD NOBLE INTENTIONS HIDDEN BEHIND HIS GODLIKE JUST-AS-PLANNED SCHEMING while making Snake look like an idiot a he bumblefucked along".

>>180154
>Who's to say a dirty skank can't be a good sniper?
I didn't.

>>180169
Solid has kind of always been bumblefucking along.

>>180167
>This is the only way we ever get to talk about games I like.

Doesn't have to be this way.

It's Metal Gear. You can talk about the games without talking about the controversy, especially a fabricated one. Hell, you can do that with games like Mortal Kombat or GTA. Hardly anyone ever brings up the controversies that surrounded those games anymore. To think that the only way to drum up conversation about these video games is to lend a hand in the shitstorm portions is silly and I wish people would learn this as well as

>>180166
>Kotaku is proving they are just creating a controversy for page views right?

That. Don't let people wanting to be mad and people pretending to be mad and people getting mad at people being mad and people pretending to get mad and people pretending to be mad get in the way of quality video game discussion.

>she's meant as an anti-thesis of characters that do dress like that in games
>In that universe it seems the men are just as likely to get half naked as women
So it may be that Quiet turns out to be a good character and it may be that this is much less remarkable next to other MGS characters, but none of this exists in a vacuum. I've heard a lot of people saying it's supposed to be subversive. How? What on earth is considered subversive about having an attractive, partially dressed female character in a video game? That's pretty much the same justification that Robin Thicke used for his shitty music video. There ain't shit that's subversive or taboo about it. Subversive would be every dude in lingerie and all the women fully dressed. The fact is that Kojima made a conscious decision to make yet another "sexy" character. It's not even so much this particular one; it's that it just KEEPS HAPPENING, and no individual rain drop feels itself responsible for the flood.

>>180171
Like father, like son.

>>180179
Yeah I'd be more understanding if it wasn't for the whole BB characters in MGS4

I think the long and short of this is that she is going to make for some excellent Rule 34.

>>180179
So, you are basically blaming the patriarchy

>>180184
Man the BB crew were terrible
Their melodrama was so thick it was laughable, and the attempt to make them "pretty on the outside broken on the inside" combined with it just made them laughable fapfodder in skin suits slinking about.

>>180179
It's like Truffaut said: you can't make a truly anti-war movie, because the very act of making a movie something an audience would sit down for is going to make the act of war look glamorous. Exploitation seems to be about the same way.

I'll never understand why there's even a debate to begin with.

Is there something inherently wrong with a woman looking attractive?

>>180192

You're kinda missing the point of the argument. And to answer your question: page views.

>>180192
It depends. If Kojima hadnt have said what he said, they're definitely wouldnt be that shitstorm

>>180192
I don't find the chick in the OP image very attractive, kinda haggerd face with porn star tits and a stupid looking outfit... its fanservice but its not exactly good stuff.

>>180192
to quote someone else on the internet:

"Well, here's the thing. It's not so much about any one piece of literature/art having a direct effect (although that DOES happen on occasion). Like, I feel like you're conceptualizing this as "the idea is if a guy watches one sexist movie he will go home and slap his girlfriend", and that's not really it.

Imagine there is a mosaic made up of one small piece of tile. Except by definition that's not really a mosaic, is it? A mosaic has to make up a bigger picture, made from smaller things.

But let's say five more tiny tiles are added to the mosaic. Then twenty more. A hundred. A thousand. Ten thousand. Now you have enough tiles to make a mosaic. Any one of those tiles is nothing more than a little bit of colored ceramic, and yet when you put them together you can form a definitive picture.

That's what our society is like. That's what our ideas of "normality" and gender relations and race relations and heteronormativity are like. They are built out of a million tiny things. So maybe ONE video game featuring Syldanian Six-Boobed Slut Warriors or whatever will not have much effect on society. The thing is, there isn't just one video game like that, and that isn't the only place the idea that women are objectified. When people criticize Hillary Clinton's appearance (because male politicians are such hotties, right? Not bloated, liver-spotted, fat old men) . . . that is a little piece of tile. When a comic artist draws kidnapped male Justice League characters in tied up but non-sexy poses, while the kidnapped female Justice League characters are tied up like they're getting geared up for a video session of "Bondage Sluts III" . . . that is a little piece of tile. When someone tells a sexist joke . . . that's a little piece of tile. Look in the comments section of any online news story about a woman being raped and you will find more little bits of tile.

And the defense is always "Well, MY piece of tile isn't at fault! It's Society!" It is indeed society that predefines the mosaic, based on the piece of tile that were placed by previous generations; but it's the individual pieces of gossip, art, expectations that fill in that mosaic. Unlike a real mosaic, old bits fall off quite frequently, forgotten by a new generation. Sometimes they are replaced by a new piece that is about the same as the old one; sometimes they are replaced by a new one. Sometimes there's a lot of new pieces at once, like in the 1960s when a bunch of activists took hammers, beat the crap out of that mosaic, and stuck a bunch of new pieces on to radically alter the picture. The point is, if no one starts changing those tiles, small as they may be, the overarching image will never change."

>>180194
Yeah as far as I see it most found the statements to be lame.

I confess, I kinda hate the "let crazies be crazies/boys will be boys" argument to defend what's basically the status quo and honestly doesn't have to be that way, but I've resigned to the fact that there exists a tidal wave of empty, moronic complaining that is what most people argue against.

>>180198
Or we could just not demonize sexuality since that is itself a part of historical misogyny and general repression (sex isn't for pleasure, it's for family etc etc).

>>180201
And have you got any plans to further that cause, or do your efforts end at trying to get people to shut up so you can enjoy your status quo?

>>180201
There is a difference between demonizing collaborative sexuality and demonizing transactional/exploitative sexuality, but I recognize the futility of trying to explain that to self-centered people who aren't actively harmed personally by the status quo.

>>180203
Woah, status quo-mind. High five.

Plus4chan supports third-wave feminism.

>>180202
>>180203
I'd willing to hear more of this, link to your tumblr so I can read your full argument.

>>180206
Sure, it's right here:
http://bit.ly/1fXiWof

So how do you guys think CQC will work? Like a designated button with a bit of melee before the person goes down or like an automatic thing? and if it's automatic can you alter the outcomes? like choosing between being quiet, fatal, non-fatal and disarming?

>>180205
You're trolling, but honestly if it were a pick your poison choice between SJW and MRAs/"anti"-SJWs, I'd choose the former. The former are dim witted, self centered, and naive. The latter are, you know, bigots.

Didn't really want to enter the argument, but if "supporting the status quo" means that I want to play games with attractive females, so be it. I too want cool looking guys, and robots, and everthing but hey, patriarchy and stuff. If by maining the Sorceress in Dragon's Crown I am shitting on Jane Addams' grave, well I'll have to deal with it in one way or another.

I guess that's my privilege? Damn, it feels good the check on it.

>>180210
But anon, MRAs are a type of social justice warrior.
>>180208
The PS4 has digital face buttons, so I don't see how they're going to pull it off as well this time around.
>>180199
The portrayal of women in media is a problem, but you can't really go about acting like any evidence of sexualization, stereotypical writing tropes, or unequal representation is inherently sexist and worthy of shaming. That would be like calling any game without decent PoC characters racist.

My fetish is well dressed and equipped female soldiers/fighters

It just looks so much more awesome than blatantly obvious spankbait

>>180212
Yeah I've been trying to wrap my head around it, very interested to see.

>>180213
Technically, if that's really a fetish, then you are objectifying the character regardless of what she may be wearing.

>>180215
Thats called a 'joke', spazz.

>>180212
Fine, redditors/btards or whatever subgroup that makes being the exact opposite of being politically correct into something self-righteous.

Didn't Kojima want to stop making these games but they sell so Konami wants more money?

>>180217
Why are you saging?

>>180215
Okay see that right there? That is you demonizing sexuality. You are saying that anytime anyone is aroused, they are embodying the patriarchy or being a traitor to women kind, depending on their sex.

>>180219
There's such a thing s a 'courtesy sage' people do when they aren't adding to the thread in general?

+4chan is a slowass board so it isn't really notable either way.

>>180215
Obviously the only fair compromise is to never depict women in the media ever again!

>>180219
Because I don't want to bump the thread.

>>180223
No more posts could be made, and this thread most likely will be in the same spot by tomorrow. This isn't 4Chan's /v/ where you could blink and a thread would drop to page 3.

>>180220
You're not allowed to be aroused. EVER.

>>180211
The difference there though is in the setting and portrayal of the characters. ALL the characters in Dragon's Crown are sexualized, Men and Women. It makes the whole thing very in-universe, and it's a little fun for everybody. Which is not actually what Feminism or the complaints against this character design are about. Sexual fun should be fun for everybody, not just appeasing to a single demographic, that's the part of the Feministic point.

But when you drop into a "pseudo-real" universe like MGS, you have to change the concepts of what represents an empowering character. The Boss and Eva are pretty good because even though they flash a fair amount of boob, they're still empowered actors affecting the story in their own right, and their cleavage is not the only thing to talk about when you talk about those characters. Meryl less so, but still, she's a young woman in the military, not exactly an easy roll to fulfill, and even her butt is kind of a gameplay element (to quote egoraptor: "that was important?"). The BBs, aside from the whole striptease thing that you only got if you stunned them into submission and then approached them carefully (never actually put it that way before but kind of creepy), even though they're wearing skintight suits, they're wearing skintight suits that allow them to interface with some of the most advanced weapons platforms on the planet. The rest of their characterization blows but tbh I kind of stopped paying attention after MGS2 and 3 ("wait even back in the 60s they had freakshow black ops teams? Okay fuck it whatever").

Quiet is a white-girl sniper in a desert that would turn her skin into a sullen red rock if left exposed for too long who choose to tool around in a bikini and torn leggings that would look trashy on a street hooker. Instead of say, a full-body cloak that would allow here to better hide within the environment and also would ostensibly keep her much cooler (know how everyone in the Middle East wears those long robes with seemingly no problem? That's because baggy clothing is really quite good at keeping you cool, especially in the desert).

I mean, I could've been really happy not knowing here gender until like 75% of the way through the game when you finally face her and it's like "woah the most badass sniper ever is actually a tiny white girl and I had no idea that's really kind of cool". As it stands, we have a not that awesome copy of Sniper Wolf who doesn't really seem that smart.

>>180226
> Quiet is a white-girl sniper in a desert that would turn her skin into a sullen red rock if left exposed for too long

MGS is full of mutant freaks with superpowers and oddball abilities, why are you assuming that isn't the case with her? That shadow around her eyes that disappeared during her close up strongly suggests that there is something going on with her.

>>180213
Haha speaking of Hilde its kind of hilarious that the creators actually set out intentionally to make a woman with a little modesty on the battlefield to balance out the fact most of their lady cast had...devolved along these lines.

>>180228
That pic is hilarious in the sense that one of the very first things you saw in Soul Blade was Sophitia nude taking a bath.

>>180226
I'd put it more simply as "her design is shit"

Its not even very sexy...

>>180229
Oh, and this how Sophitia's breast size was in the actual character model

>>180233
Uh... thats not nude?

>>180234
.... so you actually haven't played Soul Edge, right?

>>180236
What? All I did was comment on the image you posted. Where she is clearly not naked and seems to be wearing some sort of chronologically-unlikely swimsuit.
Are you talking about the opening video?

>>180227
Yeah but that's still a shitty excuse. Even Fortune kind of looked like she could hold her own without her powers. The design is just so out of sync with most of the rest of MGS that the "why" response seems fairly justified.

if it turns out to be nano machines I will kick Kojima in the balls. Not because it's Chauvinistic, but because it's dumb and if that's the answer to everything then the story really has gone to shit

>>180240
You weren't complaining when Nanomachines was the answer in Rising.

>>180241
Uh... how do you know? He's an anonymous. Maybe he did not like Rising or the rise of Nanomachines being the explain-all of MGS.

Personally I didn't like Rising because it started getting a bit too everyone is cyborg ninja instead of skilled conventional soldiers and loljapan, everyone is using melee weapons, all the main characters have named melee weapons and the only thing that can defeat the final boss and his advanced nanomachines is Sam's HF-sword because its made from an ancient katana since lol Yamato Damashii katana-wank.

>>180242
You implying that the masterful craftmanship of Japanese katanas are inferior to cowardly western pig guns?

racist

>>180246
I would like a pig gun.

>>180220

I'm not that guy but I just think it's weird that people want to be aroused so fucking much. As easy as it is to find porn in this society, you want to get turned on by the non-porn too? Even if it means pissing off half the human race?

On the other side of the argument, the actual entertainment in question with offensive depictions of women is roughly 90% Japanese so yeah.

Perhaps I am simply giving the pass to Rising because I loved the game, but I found the answer for why Sam's sword worked to be satisfactory. Raiden's sword was a big knife manucatured without giving much shit since the HF part was there to make it awesome. The blade on Sam's sword was made for combat in the first place, so applying an HF treatment made it much better. If you took a good claymore or a rapier and made them HF blades, they would be equally as effective.

>>180249
>I just think it's weird that people want to be aroused so fucking much.
You're the weird one here. Or a woman. I heard they don't like sex.

This thread reeks of ban evasion. Too bad reporting won't help, it's impossible to tell the agents from the useful idiots.

>>180252
I love how you people automatically assume it's all one person (because fuck having a similar opinion, and fuck having an opinion that's not feminist or lolban) when a mod can easily distinguish all the different IPs apart.

>>180253
I like how I suddenly represent the entire community. Does your political opinion dictate that communities must be 100% homogenous?

I also like how you assume that there cannot possibly be more than one person with 'politically incorrect' opinions on this board who got banned at some point.
Do you not know what plural is?

Are you going to call me a SRS or JIDF agent next?

>>180254
Not the same anon, but I think is a bit hilarious that you complain about politically incorrectness, and yet call that PC pieces Kotaku shits out as "yellow press garbage".

>>180255
Because opinions must be all nice and binary, right? Either religious devotion to 'political correctness' or relentless hatred of such - that's the only possible way, of course!

Start using your brain instead of demanding that reality be dumbed down to suit your limited intellect.

>>180255
B-but "yellow journalism" isn't a racist term...