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  • 08/21/12 - Poll ended; /cod/ split off as a new board from /pco/.

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72963 No. 72963
Because we need a new thread, and it's really her story now.
Expand all images
>> No. 72966
File 137976889680.gif - (12.78KB , 650x450 , 06710.gif )
Not to be standoffish, but it has in fact gone to the dogs.
>> No. 72967
So what, if anything, is going to stop HIC from mind-controlling Jack and PM? Being NPCs with animal aspects, they should be ridiculously susceptible.
>> No. 72968
She might be distracted. You would think she'd involve herself now that her prime soldier just got taken out
>> No. 72969
Well, she was only able to mind control Jade by using both Summoner and Mindfang powers, by hitting both her human side and her animal side. If Carapacians aren't susceptible to Mindfang powers (which for all we know, they're not--certainly it would've made SGRUB no contest if Vriska could've just mind controlled the Black King), she might not be able to touch them.
>> No. 72970
File 137979429586.gif - (172.75KB , 650x650 , 03059[1].gif )
Vriska did do this. And she couldn't even control humans, just make them fall asleep or wake up.
Maybe the BK was protected by his Glb'Golyb-ness or something.
>> No. 72971
It's just like in RPGs where one hit kill spells will always fail to down a major boss. Without question.
>> No. 72972
Ah, didn't remember that she got him.

One could make the case that Courtyard Droll is notoriously empty-headed, but it does prove that carapacians aren't immune, at least.
>> No. 72973
I love how the internet particularly tumblr is up in arms over Terezi "abusing" poor, sweet, mind-controlled Gamzee and hating on her real hard, but think it's hilarious and badass when Caliborn was doing even worse. Or hating on Aranea for being a callous evil bitch, but cheer on other villains like Bec Noir or DD for being essentially the same. And then cry foul on areas of general sexism. The irony is sweet.
>> No. 72974
I think at least a bit of that double standard comes from how readers "don't expect any better" from characters that have always been bad.
>> No. 72975
>I love how the internet particularly tumblr is up in arms over Terezi "abusing" poor, sweet, mind-controlled Gamzee
Buh? Did they not read the lines where she was talking to him and saying things like "NOW of all times you can't raise your hand to me?" It's pretty clear that, mind controlled or no (which Terezi isn't aware of, by the bye), Gamzee was abusing her when they were together. This is, at worst, vengeance. Not one-sided abuse.
>> No. 72976
>Jade and Calliope being all cute together

>> No. 72977
Fangirls, man. Tumblr fangirls.
>> No. 72978
Oh my god, they're going to reenact things in a cute manner aren't they.
>> No. 72979
I see what you did there
>> No. 72981
But man, we're talking about Terezi Pyrope here.
Terezi "I feed LARPing kids to giant spiders for their crimes" Pyrope. Terezi "Let's kill an entire timeline's worth of people just to see what happens, and then do it again to prove a point" Pyrope. Terezi "Most hated character in the comic before we even knew her name" Pyrope. Terezi "First character to be graphically tortured and killed in fanart" Pyrope.
That Terezi Pyrope.
>> No. 72982
I haven't seen anyone hate on Terezi for this? Everyone I've seen has been cheering for her finally standing up to Gamzee and trying to get back at him for their abusive/weird <3< thing

And I can't stand Aranea, but I think that's partly because I couldn't stand Vriska. Both of them just grate on me for reasons unknown
>> No. 72983
Bec Noir and DD don't have similar motives or methods. We also accept and love them as villains because they were introduced early in the story while doing comically evil things. This also goes for Vriska, but because she does a lot of evil things that *aren't* funny to characters people liked, she has more of a broken base.

Aranea is some annoying manipulative character who first showed up in the endgame and is doing a job that a number of pre-existing characters--particularly Eridan and Vriska--could have done had she not existed. She's not funny and her entire purpose is to add another unnecessarily complicated problem to the pile in the endgame. Why should we cheer her on? Why should we like her and enjoy what she does?
>> No. 72984
>Both of them just grate on me for reasons unknown
It's the cognitive dissonance. The villains that we like, we mostly like because they are card-carrying villains who have fun being villains and don't expect anyone to like them for it. They need no external validation for their behavior, they just like smashing things, and/or (in the case of the Condesce) they just want to accomplish their goals of enslaving the universe. So their fun personalities are enough to make them likable villains.

Vriska and Aranea are different because they want to be heroes, and want other people to recognize them as such--in fact, their entire motivation appears to be extrinsic. They only want to be heroes because they want everyone else to recognize them as heroes, most likely meaning they're full of self-loathing at their cores (this is the classic dissonance of narcissism--while narcissists build themselves up with their behavior and conversation, they ultimately do this because they are overcompensating for their assumption that they don't deserve love). They are trying to be loved by us, and that makes them inherently less lovable. It can make them sympathetic, and I think there are a lot of people who sympathize with both of them. But it doesn't make them lovable.
>> No. 72985
omgcat :D <3
>> No. 72986
Aranea isn't doing it for glory, though; she's doing it because she believes she can save evryone everywhere forever and was tired of just sitting in the afterlife.
>> No. 72987
Yeah hit the nail on the head about the Serkets. Mindfang seems like the only Serket that didn't give a shit what others thought of her, though we only have her journal to go by. The sad pathetic thing about Vriska and Aranea is that they have no idea what they're doing wrong nor why nobody seems to care about them, and this only drives them to try harder and be even worse. There are few who genuinely care about them but they don't realize it despite being mind readers.

I think what makes me really sad about Aranea is that she went from an empath who understood others on an emotional level, to someone who sees everyone as an obtacle or disposable pawn whose lives she can play with. There's signs she sees herself this way too, more like a story character instead of a person.
>> No. 72988
Great point. It's hard to feel any sort of empathy for a character that showed up so close to the end and is apparently super powerful/all knowing/holy shit amazing. Seems forced to me, I suppose
>> No. 72989
I for one welcome our new spider overlord. Seriously, I'm enjoying Aranea's intrusion into the game. I've always enjoyed her character, and seeing her take on such a drastic role was a huge surprise, which I love. Also, she's getting things done in a big way. In this series where it can take weeks for us to get anything more than witty dialog, she's basically stormed in and flipped over a number of tables. I can respect that.
>> No. 72990
>I think what makes me really sad about Aranea is that she went from an empath who understood others on an emotional level, to someone who sees everyone as an obtacle or disposable pawn whose lives she can play with. There's signs she sees herself this way too, more like a story character instead of a person.
That fits with how Vriska sees herself as a powerplaying video game character first and foremost based on her experience FLARPing, and expects everyone else to live up to her standards of achievement. Not sure if it's an issue of self image, or if she just seriously thinks that's the only practical way to do things.
Personally, I've usually found Vriska fairly lovable because she handles video games much like I do, and tries to share her knowledge only to be frustrated by a lack of interest from listeners, but she does go too far in terms of pushing others to accomplish things.

I'm thinking there's a possibility that Jake could end up turning on Aranea, or at least her plans, by hoping for something other than what he wants her to hope for. We haven't seen the mind control symbol on him, so she might not be considering the possibility due to her precaution of making sure he thinks she's super hot, which admittedly might have worked easily if Jake was Equius, but as it is he's already shown some ability to resist her.

Also, I like how the cuts Dirk made on Aranea made the nose and mouth of a face, with part of the blue design on her shirt forming the eyes.
>> No. 72991
I'm just glad to see a character that's not utterly clueless or apathetic about what's going on. With an acual plan and not just "I feel that's what I'm supposed to do."
>> No. 72992
>We haven't seen the mind control symbol on him

That's because she can't control humans, only put them to sleep.

Which is why I'm so curious about what she's gonna try to pull off. Sure she was able to 'heal' him against his will, but now he's more or less omnipotent. Seduction didn't work, she can't directly control him and his subconciousness just manifested a Dirk to battle her for him. Just what does she have up her sleeve if she's planning on using that power to her own ends?
>> No. 72993
Maybe she actually thinks her cause is so great that any sufficiently informed good character would side with her.
>> No. 72994
RIP Dave/Jade
>> No. 72995
File 137999249440.gif - (484.25KB , 499x375 , teeheehee.gif )
>my face when Hot mom?

My gosh you guys. These updates have just been pure gold.
>> No. 72996
Dave confirmed for breaking Jane's tiara's grip on her through the power of love
>> No. 72997
Look at that timing.

RIP Rose.
>> No. 72998
D'aw, look at Jane blush. Cute.
>> No. 72999

Jane/the robot is supposed to go crazy or something any moment now. Is is because of this?
>> No. 73000
Dave is going to be covered in Crockley bitches.
>> No. 73002

From the look of things, Rose's gonna meet her mama in the Void any second now
>> No. 73003
I hope Rose does the seer thing, sees the horseshit Aranea's trying to pull and figures out how to stop her
>> No. 73004
yeah, except Aranea probably realizes that Rose as a fellow Light player likely is the biggest threat to her plans
which is why she'll have Dirk stab the shit outta her in just a few seconds when she goes to check on Roxy
>> No. 73005
If that happens I will oficially flip my shit
>> No. 73006
I hope Hussie makes another Charlie Brown reference with Aranea psyching the football from Dirk's way in order to stab Rose.

wait...could that mean...Dirk=Meenah??
>> No. 73007
Again, though, Aranea can only manipulate luck, not rewrite causality. Jade was a special case because while they were long shots, there were legitimate interpretations that could have made her death Just, meaning Aranea was able to use luck to nudge it in the direction she needed it to go. Ganking Rose in the back while she's distracted by talking to her mom, and having not made any effort to attack anyone, doesn't really have ANY good interpretations as Heroic or Just.

So I think it's really unlikely that Rose ends up perma-dead here. But I'd say it's fairly likely that she's going to be taking a nap like Roxy before she gets to do anything to get in Aranea's way. Which might actually be a good thing because she might be able to join Roxy in whatever dream bubble Roxy's ended up in for the time being.
>> No. 73008
Maybe it could count as heroic becuse it'd be an attempt to save Roxy from the evil, evil spiderpirate?
>> No. 73009
Why didn't Aranea just put Jade to sleep then?
>> No. 73010
HIC already did that. The "dog" side of Jade they probably can only mind control and not put to sleep.
>> No. 73012
The more I reread, the more I can't tell if something's an intentional callback or random coincidence.

Homosuck: Alternia Edition

Karkat Can't Fly
>> No. 73013
I would just brush it off as continuity but at this point it might as well be foreshadowing.
>> No. 73014
I would just brush it off as continuity but at this point it might as well be foreshadowing.
>> No. 73015
Soul Taker
>> No. 73016
Mad that someone almost kissed your not-boyfriend? RIP THEIR SOUL OUT
>> No. 73018
Dirk has the most metal powers of anyone in the comic
>> No. 73021
Dirk is Shang Tsung now.
>> No. 73025
I prefer Palpadirk
>> No. 73036
Woah I remembered something. This isn't actually Aranea vs. Dirk. It's Aranea remade by herself based on her views of Mindfang, vs. Dirk remade by Jake based on his views of real Dirk. It's basically an imaginary ego pissing contest.

Guys sometimes it's like Hussie gets really super complex but you can't tell if a real point is being made.
>> No. 73037
...right? It's like is it coincidence or is he is he deliberately hiding the literary qualities beneath fifteen layers of silliness?
>> No. 73039
>Guys sometimes it's like Hussie gets really super complex but you can't tell if a real point is being made.
Has it occurred to you this whole thing might just be a massive waste of time?
>> No. 73040
It's not on purpose. He just has too many characters and ideas and has absolutely no filter on them. The more things are added, more patterns will emerge unintentionally, and the more things readers will be able to find if they squint. This is why Homestuck got so popular in the first place, with so many fans pumping out art and stories of it. But it's not complex, there's just this illusion of complexity that you're creating in your head. Whether or not authorial intent matters is up to you, but the authorial intent in this case was to make two characters fight and one would literally rip the soul out of another's body. That's it, that's all, no symbolism here. He's not a genius, but he is good at pretending to be one.
>> No. 73042
I've read his Formsprings and stuff, and based on those I don't think he intentionally tries to pretend to be a genius, either. Usually when people give him too much credit for stuff he laughs and says they're overthinking things.

I think there is some complexity to Hussie's style, though less by planning and more by who Hussie is. The complexity mostly comes down to the fact that he's able to keep things both silly and serious at the same time, without having to have "drama sections" and "comedy sections." It's a balancing act that a lot of people doing dramedy have a lot of trouble with, and I think it does take a special skill that Hussie is very versed in.

But yeah, it's not like he sits down and has this immense plan to throw the entire world of symbolism into a story. He probably has knowledge of a lot of that stuff and when he spots a thread that he can exploit for those purposes, uses it, but he's not some sort of grand Chessmaster author, planning moves years in advance. He's more of an Indiana Jones sort, going with the flow and just dealing with the problem that's in front of him--and yeah, sometimes his ways of dealing with those problems are quite clever, but that doesn't take genius.
>> No. 73043
Is there a feminine counterpart to "bromance"? Because I need to term this thing that I see and love.
>> No. 73053
its fuckign friendship you moron
>> No. 73054
No. Bromances between women are pretty normal, so everyone just calls it friendship :( I think youcan just call it a bromance though, I mean really who cares?

sororomance? womance?
>> No. 73055
i don't care what this is,

>> No. 73056
I mean they are both not-that-great people but I'm glad they've found each other in this way? I mean sure Meenah had Aranea and Vriska used to have Terezi, but they never really *got* each other like these two
>> No. 73057
bout time homestucks BEST CHARACTER got some spotlight.
talkin bout aradia of course
>> No. 73058
A blossoming <> relationship?
>> No. 73059
Seems more <3 to me. Not enough pacification for a <>.
>> No. 73061
So does that mean that Meenah<3Karkat is old n busted, and Vriska<3Meenah is new hottness?
>> No. 73062
Dang, that's an even bigger age gap right there.
>> No. 73064
or just, y'know friendship outside quadrants. like karkat and kanaya.
>> No. 73065
does that even really matter honestly? I mean if we're going by years rather than physical maturity I'm pretty sure Vriska's been along for longer, since she had already spent quite some time in the bubbles before Meenah showed up
>> No. 73066
>been along for longer
derp sleepyhead
>> No. 73067
A possibility, but that "I would've never met you" line was pretty cheesy in at least a "Burgeoning BFFsies" way.
>> No. 73069
Nooooo my otp

>> No. 73070
File 138067972897.gif - (561.96KB , 500x500 , 1362816874649.gif )
Whow were you expecting, eintein, the TOOTH FAIRY?

'nuff said.
>> No. 73071
Man, Vriska is my favorite and all but even I want to smack her upside the head right now.
>> No. 73072
What, really? I was thinking that this is the first update that has given me any real hope that she might be able to be redeemed into a Heroic character before Homestuck is over.
>> No. 73073
Except she's pulled this introspective and repentant bs before, and she threw Aranea under the bus a lot, not giving any thought to each's unique situation and how they lead each Serket to do what they've done. Remember, despite Aranea's few hangups early on, she was still incredibly lucid about herself. Moreso than Vriska right now. The problem with Serkets though is once their plans are in motion, they get severe tunnel vision.

Meenah though continues to be pretty glubbin perfect.
>> No. 73074
Yeah, but this is the first time she's really seemed to get what the problem with her has been. All those other times, she's dissembled and honed in on something that was never really why she was disliked. This time she's hit the nail on the head. Plus, she's becoming close friends with Meenah now, and she hasn't really had any close friends during the course of the story--though it's likely she was close with Terezi before the Charge/Scourge debacle.
>> No. 73075
That's a good point, it's like Vriska has these increasing moments of clarity followed by fucking up yet again, until finally reaching the goal of enlightenment. ::::)

It's sad though. She always had people who cared about her, she just didn't see it or refused to see it. That also is what makes Aranea leaving them so heartbreaking for me, because after seeing them make fun of her behind her back, she continued from that point onward believing they didn't give a shit about her. The two people in the entire world she cared about. Because of that, she gave no fucks about abandoning them.

Ungh I'm spilling my Serket feelings all over the place.
>> No. 73078
I wonder why Aradia's hanging around
>> No. 73079
it's basically her job, remember? observing and making sure shit goes as intended
>> No. 73080
She's probably waiting for Lord English who will show up just in time to ruin this nice moment. Arcadia has become the black cat sign of impending doom.
>> No. 73083
Okay that was a LOT easier than expected.
>> No. 73084
Really though. Rose has once again been distracted from her seering duties. First by the horrorterrors, Scratch and her magic, then by being tricked into going grimdark, then by her excessive drinking and dreambubble shenanigans and now by the Rogue of Void. Funny when you think about it.

This is nowhere near as bad, of course. It's just that the aspect of Light is probably the one who has the most say in the outcome of events, but Rose has always been more drawn towards the Void... and I think it's fair to say it's due to her somewhat tragic relationship with Mom, trying to emulate and distance herself from her at the same time. I wish Roxy would wake up so they could talk shit out and she could get over her guilt for Mom's death and how she treated her. Rose hasn't been doing her job since way back when she ascended, and she needs to, right now, more than ever.
>> No. 73085
I love Rose's face in the last panel. You can almost hear the quiet freakout over "oh my god I'm holding my mother"
>> No. 73086
Okay that was a LOT easier than expected.
>> No. 73087
Actually, I think she's spent more hours doing her job than not doing it. She spent like two years researching important information on the asteroid. Compare that to the one day she spent messing around her own session from Acts 1-5 and the maybe one year she spent drinking and dating Kanaya.
>> No. 73090
And while collecting all that info for Callie was important and all they are currently in kind of an emergency situation. The alpha timeline, the new universe and the lives of her friends are all at stake, and that's entirely ignoring English. Yeah sure Rose and Roxy have both been completely dumbstruck upon meeting each other in the bubbles and such, but they gotta snap out of it right now as they are both completely worthless in the presence of the other. Just look at how Rose acted. Rather than trying to assess the situation or using her Seer powers or going after Dave (who is her best match) she just instantly went for Roxy. She's supposed to be a strategist and a conductor, but instead she acts like a complete derp.

I actually wouldn't be surprised if the Condesce catches them, just cuz.
>> No. 73091
I'm thinking Dirk's unbelievable soul stunts could be contributing to his increase in fakeness. They're just too unreal.

While light and time are a powerful combination, I don't see how it wouldn't currently help to have Rose advise Roxy on what things to steal the nothingness from, and how to do it. A Rose/Dave teamup can wait until it's time to face LE, or at least until the time to start training for it.
>> No. 73092
From a human and realistic standpoint nothing you said made any sense.

Perhaps because it's not Dirk? Jake thinks this is what a Prince of Heart's powers do. He is probably right but not-Dirk is directly powered by Jake right now.
>> No. 73093
Brain Ghost Dirk has always had a weird existence. He claims that he's just Jake's mental image of Dirk, but at the same time he's also kind of an aspect of Real Dirk? I don't know. But I don't think it's wrong to assume that his powers are the same as Real Dirk. It's only his existence that depends on Jake's belief.
>> No. 73094
If this Ghost Brain Dirk came from Jake then maybe Jake is sucking the soul out of Aranea to get Roxy away from him to keep her safe?

Or I'm over thinking this?
>> No. 73095
Watch Jake absorb Aranea's soul, then Cal!Jack crashes into them forming the actual Lord English.

Gamzee admires it fondly. His work is done and it is glorious.
>> No. 73096
gj jane, g o o d j o b

what i'm saying is, she needs to get her shit fixed and do her goddamn job
>> No. 73097
Can I just say that no one has had their shit together in a long time and it's starting to get old?
>> No. 73098
Kind of the point when one of the main themes is growing up.
>> No. 73099
there is no theme in homestuck anymore
>> No. 73100
God. Finally, somebody shut him up. But now we don't get to see what would have happened with the spider soul.
>> No. 73101
what if it just continues to dangle by ger feet
>> No. 73102
wacky waving inflatable arm-waving tube troll
>> No. 73103
Why the shit did Jane do that
>> No. 73104
I don't think she saw what Ghost Brain Dirk was doing from her vantage point, and just presumed Jake was loyal to Aranea.
>> No. 73105
She probably did it so that Aranea can't use him for her own purpose. She can always resurrect him later.
>> No. 73106
Well it's not like that was a Heroic or Just death. He'll just pop back to life and be out of Aranea's influence (maybe)
>> No. 73107
It's already been established that you are at fault for actions that you weren't in control of though.
Stopping him from being used for Aranea's evil purposes is just.
>> No. 73108
Jake wasn't "corrupted" by evil powers, he was overwhelmingly overflowing with the power of Hope. Aranea wasn't controlling his actions, she just opened the floodgate of his potential. And I'm hesitant to call Aranea's purposes evil.
>> No. 73109
But he wasn't doing anything? During his exaggerated powering up all that happened was that he knocked out Jade accidentally (which if anything is Heroic) and screamed his ex boyfriend into existence. I really doubt either of those count.

Either way, Jane will just revive him
>> No. 73110
If Jane could resurrect him, then why did she hope for his forgiveness? Kind of pointless unless she intends to make him stay down.
>> No. 73111
She's still killing him. And resurrecting him will mean she can't resurrect him later.
>> No. 73112
Maybe she wants his forgiveness because even if you come back afterward, getting a fork through your chest still hurts like hell.
>> No. 73113
Evil robots aren't supposed to feel bad though. Can we say she's cured yet?
>> No. 73114
If she was "cured," she wouldn't be throwing a giant fork into her friend's chest. She was never as far gone as she claimed to be. All this time she's been claiming to be emotionless and calculating, yet she's always making mistakes and showing emotion.
>> No. 73115
Yeah, just like Jade she still retains rather significant parts of her personality, despit being evil and crazy. Aranea even mocked her for having such strong feelings for her "family."
>> No. 73122
I guess that answers the question of whether or not Aranea really planned it all along or was stupidly in over her head. Poor spider troll.

But especially poor Terezi. ;_;
>> No. 73123
Oh dear god. Terezi needs to get the hell out of there NOW
>> No. 73124
Sure, I get that Terezi's mistake of sympathizing with Gamzee is meant to show Gamzee sympathizers how dangerously stupid they are, but do they get that?
>> No. 73125
lolno, fangirls are too stupid to get that
like that one aranea worshipper
"no aranea ISN'T a crazy evil dictator-in-the-making who wishes to emulate mindfang, considers free will a privilege, kills or incapacitates people because they're in her way and emotionally broke terezi because she is convinced that she knows what's best for everyone! she's just misunderstood and wants the best for everyone! the true hero of the story! roxy is a total bitch for speaking out against her!"
>> No. 73126
Looking closer I realize Terezi lost a tooth in that last panel.

Also that one page was enough to make me remember how much I miss nice silly stoned Gamzee. John really needs to throw a slime pie into this guy's face.
>> No. 73127
Well hopefully, Aranea will at accept her defeat and go along with helping the kids in their existing plans. Maybe even put Gamzee back under mind control to specifically order him to cooperate with Terezi in working out their issues healthily. That'd probably work better in the long run than getting him back on sopor slime, at least unless it's relatively controlled doses like one would get from sleeping in it.
>> No. 73128
Can't someone just chop his head off? Seriously, guys.

Wow really? I love Aranea and she is one of my favorites but I still thought "oh you poor, dumb bitch" during that whole mess of a twist.
>> No. 73130
Do you seriously think that would kill him?
>> No. 73131
Safe to say, no they did not. Some of the reactions to the update I saw from the Gamzee apologists...*shudder*
>> No. 73132
File 13812478928.gif - (8.49KB , 650x450 , 06783.gif )
I honestly don't know what to make of Gamzee anymore.
>> No. 73133
Of course not, but we are desperate at this point for the clown to just die.
>> No. 73134
why is this even happening
>> No. 73135
He's better at trolling the audience than Vriska. His title seems to be meta seeing that their is a lot of fan-wankery rage at the update throughout the fandom.
>> No. 73136
The thing that makes him shittier and more annoying than Vriska, though, is that there's no logic to his actions. We knew Vriska's MO, why she did it, and what she was thinking when she did it. We loved and hated her for it. But we don't know why Gamzee does what he does. He isn't the same character we knew back in Act 5, but there isn't really a clear reason why he changed and started murdering his friends and manipulating and abusing Terezi, other than "lol he's crazy so he does bad things to characters you like, also I got bored of him being sweet/stoned and killer clowns are funny so you just have to take it." His exact effect on the audience is different than Vriska, even though in both cases they're pretty fucking mad about it.
>> No. 73137

This is the best summary of why I hate Gamzee. This guy could've been a good character but after he went "God Tier" this guy should have been killed off a LONG time ago. I feel like the story can run without this shitlord.

Like you said, adleast Vriska explained why she did all the stunts she pulled.
>> No. 73138
The thing is that Gamzee's craziness isn't completely random. It's part of his character concept, down to his trollhandle. It's all about capriciousness. He changes his mind, and his affiliation, over and over again. He changes from being mellow and introspective to full of rage.

I think at any given moment, you can expect Gamzee's behavior to be fairly consistent with one specific scheme/personality, until it changes, and then it will be consistent with THAT scheme/personality until then. We've only seen him transition between one personality and another a couple of times on-screen--most of his transitions are offscreen.

This is why I think everyone who thinks Gamzee is going to turn out to have planned out some massive manipulation of the game is going to end up being wrong. He's going to have plans that went into effect, but it's not going to be one big megaplan with a single goal. It's going to be dozens of half-finished plans that made things go crazier.

He's a wild card, essentially. More literally than that term is usually meant--whichever side he's on at the moment has their capacity for tipping the scales enhanced by a lot, but he's not going to be there for long.
>> No. 73139
which in turn is why he's a bard
>> No. 73140
But listen. That doesn't mean it's not shit. You also misunderstood what I said, because I never said his behaviour was "completely random," only inexplicable in a bad way.

Characters with no internal logic and no moral code can be very interesting characters... when they're heavily featured in the story, where we get to see them interact with other characters and we get a lot of insight as to what's going on in their head at that point in time. So we can understand them a bit, even if that realisation comes in the form of "this person is just a black hole on the inside"--which is a really great reaction to get, especially if the audience up until that point had trusted the character; they feel betrayed and horrified by it. You can only get this if the character remains consistent in their behaviour the entire time, but a hint entirely changes the audience's perception of them and their past actions. This hint is usually something subtle, when it's done right.

Here's where Gamzee fucked up: his actions post-game do not at all match what he was like in Act 5.1. He is a minor character we received no insight on other than that he seemed to care for his friends and was religious prior to his murder spree, and none after other than that he is CRRRRAAAAZYYYY. Going back to read his few Act 5.1 appearances, where his character is established, they still read like a genuinely nice (if kind of spacey) dude. There's still nothing to them that seem sinister after the revelation that he was not nice at all. He just does not read like the same character. There's a reason why there's a camp of Gamzee fans out there who just flat-out refuse to believe he is truly evil--they are holding onto extremely contradictory information they obtained in Act 5.1. They wouldn't exist if there hadn't been such a huge fucking flaw in how his character arc (if you can even call it that) was laid out.

Hussie does this thing a lot, where characters don't show up for a while and when they do they are different than before with little explanation and serves it up as character development. Dude, it's not development if the reader never witnesses any of it happening. Gamzee is the most egregious example of it but we've been seeing it very frequently for a while. I suspect he is trying to take shortcuts because he now has too many characters and plotlines to deal with to focus on character growth. I also suspect that he had the idea for Gamzee to go berserk and reveal his true nature all along, but he beefed it spectacularly since this kind of arc requires you to carefully lay traps and that did not happen.

Another related issue is that he has more or less completed his arc, with the murder spree being the real climax of the thing, but he's stayed on in the cast anyway. (Vriska also kind of has this problem, where she has done her thing and died, ending her story and serving as a catalyst to further Terezi's, but she's still in the story for some reason as a static character who repeats her old grievances to Meenah.) I'd be more forgiving if he went berserk and then was shot down, which would make his entire character sort of pointless, but he wouldn't be an ongoing problem at least.
>> No. 73141
holy fucking shit

someone do something
karkat stop being usless
kanaya stop standing around
rose stop being the dumbest derp
dave stop chasing dogs
jake just die again pls
>> No. 73142
Well that was terrible.
>> No. 73143
How ironic for Terezi to fall to her death in a sea of red. Just like how he killed Equius, with irony.
>> No. 73144
I wouldn't hate it quite as much if it wasn't for the fact that he'll walk away completely unscathed from this
>> No. 73145
File 138148512573.png - (313.26KB , 796x548 , ironu.png )
>> No. 73146
Sorry this is going to be a shitty short reply to your fantastic post (and I do mean that sincerely) but I guess there's still the problem of the sopor pies? Karkat did mention it does stuff to a troll's mind, so perhaps the insanity we're seeing now is exactly that: The failures of a chemically ruined mind.

That, or he was nuts from the outset and used the sopor like self medication.
>> No. 73147
Dave, say the day again. Do the dramatic catchy thing.

I do love the atomic juggalo suplex though
>> No. 73148
Dave, say the day again. Do the dramatic catchy thing.

I do love the atomic juggalo suplex though
>> No. 73149
Hussie really wants to have his cake and eat it too here. He wants to have this dramatic sequence of Gamzee doing really vile and violent things to TZ, but he still wants to act like he is above the "anime" fightscene drama stuff by contrasting whats going on with the slapstick fight between Aranea and Jane.Then when THATS done he also tries to downplay what gamzee has done with a codpiece joke and funny attack names and it just kind of feels awkward and doesn't work at least to me.
>> No. 73150
it's really bad.
>> No. 73151
The worst part is the slapstick allows for an excuse to laugh off Gamzee's actions here like gratuitous violence and abuse is a joke.

....SOCIAL COMMENTARY???? no probably not actually
>> No. 73152
>but he still wants to act like he is above the "anime" fightscene drama stuff
Above the what now? I apparently don't watch enough anime because I didn't think to project this sort of thought onto it.
>> No. 73153
You realize of course that that's pretty much been what the comic has been from the beginning. Juxtaposition of drama and utter silliness that deflates the "dignity" that most stories would derive from said drama. If this is a problem for you, I'm surprised you've made it as far as you have into Homestuck.
>> No. 73154
I didn't see it as him trying to be "above" dramatic anime fights. Dramatic events are happening in the story and Hussie is playing it off as a joke. He's been doing this the entire comic, and I'd be surprised if you really only find it awkward now.

Hussie can't always mix comedy and drama well, I've found certain moments in Homestuck that didn't do it well, but I don't have a problem with this scene.
>> No. 73155
Jake, I've never particularly liked you, but I swear, if you just stand idly by while Terezi falls into lava, you are going to the top of the freaking list. The list is not a good place to be, Jake. You don't want to be on the list.
>> No. 73156
>The worst part is the slapstick allows for an excuse to laugh off Gamzee's actions here like gratuitous violence and abuse is a joke.

Indeed. Serial murder and genocide are one thing to joke about, but ABUSE?! TOO FAR.

Yeah, he's pretty much the only one in a position where he can save her. I don't dislike Terezi at all but I don't particularly care for her either, so I'm kind of indifferent about what happens next.
>> No. 73157
Not always the case. Some things have been handled with a lot of poignancy and without an ounce if humor. I mean, look at what comic we're talking about. Homestuck is all about kids and fun, right?
>> No. 73158
I'm so sorry for your pathological inability to tell when something is objectively bad.
>> No. 73159
When did I discount serial killing and genocide
>> No. 73161
Gamzee is a serial killer, and Lord English has committed not just genocide, but omnicide in several universes, as well as double killing a lot of ghosts. The fact that you're only complaining about the abuse rather than about those other things is what makes people say you're discounting those things as though they are somehow less bad than the fact that Gamzee's also abusive, in addition to being a serial killer and having several times in the past aided and abetted in a known genocidist.
>> No. 73162
Those things are also terrible. Should I list every example atrocity known to mankind shown in Homestuck? We'd be here forever.
>> No. 73163
No, we are questioning why after all this time you haven't started questioning the validity / social responsibility of black comedy until now.
>> No. 73164
I don't hate it because because it's black comedy, I hate it because it's black comedy done badly.

There are also reasons why jokes about death are not on the same level as jokes about abuse or rape, and you shouldn't hide behind "but it's black comedy! You should just get a sense of humour!" when you get called out on it, but I'm not going to go into that because Gamzee curbstomping Terezi isn't actually the joke. It's a legitimately brutal and horrifying beatdown interspersed with stupid things in an attempt to keep the situation from getting too dark. But he didn't pull it off very well.
>> No. 73165
You sure like to insult an alien's way of life. What the fuck is wrong with you?
>> No. 73166
well that went terrible
>> No. 73167
I think you're talking to two different people here.

This doesn't seem appropriate to Alternian standards either, considering Karkat and Kanaya's reactions.
>> No. 73168
>I don't hate it because because it's black comedy, I hate it because it's black comedy done badly.
Just like Family Guy.
>> No. 73169
You know, the last time I heard Family Guy brought up in relation to Homestuck was actually complimenting the latter: way back when some people were still hanging on to the old interpretation of Equuis being abusive to his lusus it was pointed out that it didn't really make sense, since the subverted expectation that it really WAS an accident is a joke with an actual punchline while "oh he hit him so hard he got a bruise!...and that's it" isn't.
>> No. 73170

No, that it's a dark and horrible beatdown set in contrast with these silly things is the joke. The jokes aren't there to distract from the beatdown. The beatdown is part of the joke.

I can't believe I even had to just explain that to you.
>> No. 73172
It's not the butt of the joke.

But idk why you're arguing? Your interpretation just makes this sequence even stupider?
>> No. 73173

I don't even know what you're trying to say.
>> No. 73174
Personally, I think Gamzee's behavior could also be a bit confusing due to weird time shit, since a lot of the important moments in his development happen before or after we actually see the effects. I'm not even really sure when some things that happened to him occurred in relation to others, such as whether he fondly regarded events at 0:00:00 before of after being soosh-papped. And we haven't even seen what ends up preparing him to take care of the baby cherubs.
>> No. 73175
whether or not it is a joke making light of abuse it's still shitty writing.
>> No. 73176
um, are you forgetting all the stabs terezi just gave to gamzee
>> No. 73177
are you being retarded on purpose?
>> No. 73178
The whole point of showing her stab him a bunch of times was to show how futile it was. It was intended to be tragic, because even after she got her will to fight back, it didn't mean anything and only served to make her feel weaker.

I can't believe I had to explain that.
>> No. 73179
>even after she got her will to fight back
I take some issue with this line. First, I highly doubt that the Terezi we all know would have just sat there whimpering if Gamzee ever hit her. I think it's much more likely that they've fought in the past. But like, blackrom fighting; where you kinda hope the other guy dies but you also kinda don't. The difference now is that she really does want to kill him so she's going all out.

I do think their relationship was abusive, but more in terms of how Gamzee made her feel about her blindness and not about him beating her. And even then, I'm not sure if what he said was over the line for a quote-unquote healthy black relationship, or if it wasn't and Terezi was just too emotionally vulnerable at the time.
>> No. 73180
How can she fight back if Gamzee was not threatening her at that point? She's did it because she felt like letting Gamzee leave her alone would somehow mean he has won. This is more of an over-the-top "you can't break up with me, I'm breaking up with you!" situation than anything else.
>> No. 73181
He's talking about in the long term. Gamzee <3< Terezi has been an abusive relationship, and Terezi wasn't fighting back until she decided to go "Clown Hunting." This is her fighting back after months of not fighting back. Not "This is her fighting back after this five minutes of them interacting just now."
>> No. 73182
But it is not necessary for her to fight back now. She's just tired to get her revenge on him and is now paying for it dearly.
>> No. 73183
>Terezi wasn't fighting back until she decided to go "Clown Hunting."
How do you know this? I don't remember this ever being said.
>> No. 73184
>> No. 73186
That says he attacked her, not that she didn't fight back.
>> No. 73188
>But like, blackrom fighting; where you kinda hope the other guy dies but you also kinda don't. The difference now is that she really does want to kill him so she's going all out.
I consider this enough of a difference for not going all out to be "not fighting back", just because without that it could easily be confused from a troll perspective as actively pursuing a blackrom relationship. It could be seen as sparring, play fighting, or even venting frustration, but not really fighting back.
>> No. 73192
File 138189202589.jpg - (75.23KB , 650x470 , mspa-homestuck-book03.jpg )
Let's talk about how Hussie dropped the ball by not having this cover lenticular so we could see Dave's arm actually making the head "snkkt" motion instead of looking like he wants you to gtfo.
>> No. 73193
So Rose got the quills of echidna? How? Last time we saw, John had them when he performed the scratch.

that being said, shit's about to go crazy, )-(ic's decided to show up. I guess we're with John in Caliborn's narrative again though, as per standed abondoning on a cliffhanger procedure
>> No. 73194
YES. HOMOSUCK IS BACK. You should be thrilled about this, not bummed.
>> No. 73195
Did anyone notice SBAHJ updated?
>> No. 73196
Maybe she found them on the meteor, or in the bubbles.
>> No. 73197
Sigh. Well, thanks for trying Jake. Granted you didn't try very hard, but you did try.

Also, Skai is apparently being flooded with lava. Good luck on that session, guys!
>> No. 73198
Maybe she found them on the meteor, or in the bubbles.
>> No. 73199
It wouldn't have been too hard for John to just drop them somewhere for Rose to pick up, though we didn't actually see it. Maybe it's something that happened in the time that was skipped over right after they arrived?
>> No. 73200
Nice tease with the red lava engulfing the Skaia ball. I was convinced we were about to see a cheesy sequence of Karkat DBZ powering up to realizing his full blood powers, after seeing Terezi almost bite it. Would have been the worst cliché ever.
>> No. 73201
Or maybe she just made new ones. The stuff you've already made gets added to your Alchemy Excursus, and at this point their Grist supply is more or less limitless.
>> No. 73203
I actually thought he was using his blood powers to affect Gamzee's behaviour or sumthin. But then that didn't.
>> No. 73206
But Rose never made them in the first place. They were with the bunny.
>> No. 73207
I really hate to say it, but I feel like SB&HJ has gotten kinda stale.
>> No. 73228
File 138388817445.jpg - (257.57KB , 800x604 , February-preview.jpg )
I am in love with this years Calendar
>> No. 73229
Roxy's hips are out of control.
>> No. 73239
Awesome drawing aside, I'm more bothered by the lack of fuschia painted on Condy's nails.
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