Well, time to break out my waifu folder

>>111929

>>111932

>>111933

>>111935

>>111940

>>111943

>>111946

>>111979
Okay, that is freaking awesome.

http://geersart.tumblr.com/post/50090700114/sketchin-colors

>>112007

>>112007
omg yes plz

>>112007
Bad. Ass.

"If I kill a person, who cares? I CAN MAKE A NEW ONE."

>>112017
>>112018
>>112019

>>112017
>>112018
>>112019

I remember these. Great to see them again.

anybody else think Mai and Jet would have been a cool pairing?

>>112141

>>112141
It might force Mai to tell her position on the war and colonization. That would be interesting to hear.

>>112143

I don't think Mai cares enough to have an opinion

>>112141
Not really.

This is totally my opinion, and I'm not saying everyone who likes the ship does this, but it always seemed like a way to kill two popular ships with one stone (canon Maiko and crack Jetko) to free Zuko up for someone else. That and the fact that Mai and Jet never met each other in the series, although that's not a requirement for crackships, I guess.

I fear she has been banished from canon never to be seen again. ;_;

>>112163
Considering she just had an entire (admittedly, short and free) comic released about her. I find myself doubting that very strongly.

There's a cool thread still up on /co/ about potential Avatar spin-offs. Some anons and I had a pretty good discussion last night about a hypothetical series where Mai becomes a wandering ninja learning what it's like to be a single mom while taking care of her brother.

https://boards.4chan.org/co/res/50016549

>>112165
That was a good thread. Know if anyone saved the writing from it?

>>112165
That was a good thread. Know if anyone saved the writing from it?

>>112167

I have, but I'm waiting until the thread on /co/ 404's before I post it here.

>>112167

http://archive.foolz.us/co/thread/50016549

To summarize:

>Mai gets her own spin-off of her traveling the four nations alone with Tom-Tom, Lone Wolf & Cub style.
>As she roams the planet, trying to stay under the radar, she tangles with bandits attacking villages, political factions taking advantage of the chaos and uncertainty of the post-Ozai era in addition to mercenaries hired by her father to drag her and Tom-Tom back home.
>She does odd jobs for strangers to pay for traveling expenses.
>People she meets often give her food and shelter because they believe Mai's a single mother and Tom-Tom is her son.
>Mai doesn't like this very much, but deals with it.
>June is one of the first people her father hires to track her.
>After their first duel, June and Mai gradually go from foes to friend-enemies. June has a habit of dropping in on Mai unexpectedly.
>Tom-Tom likes his "Auntie June."
>Mai is extremely paranoid and uncomfortable about anyone touching Tom-Tom.
>Although Mai struggles to survive and protect her brother, she refuses to seek Zuko or the Gaang's help, doesn't trust her family and doesn't like taking hand outs, wanting to find and earn her own way.
>Mai begins asking what her purpose and place in life is supposed to be. She visits and leaves offerings at various shrines as she discovers her spirituality through her hardships.
>Mai's close quarters weapon of choice would either be a short katana or sais.
>Characters she'd meet and/or fight would include The Freedom Fighters, Colonel Mongke & The Rough Rhinos, various OC, as well as under explored characters from the show.
>She and Tom-Tom might run into a spirit or demon or two.
>Mai starts to see Tom-Tom more like a son, becoming less offended by people thinking she's a mom.
>The entire story would reference and pay homage to various ninja and samurai animation/movies, being fairly episodic and relying on atmosphere and quiet tension.

Why do I see Ty Lee asking Mai how things have been after all this, only for Mai to just say "Eh, pretty boring."

>>112169

>Although Mai struggles to survive and protect her brother, she refuses to seek Zuko or the Gaang's help
>She and Tom-Tom might run into a spirit or demon or two.

Potential conflict with these two bullet points. Now that the Avatar is around and about again, Aang is bound to be summoned by places that encounter spirit world shenanigans. If Mai runs into some spirits, she's bound to run into Aang (at the very least) from time to time.

>>112170

Aang's only one person, he can't be expected to be at every forest that has a patron spirit or at every outlying village that has a problem with a local phantom I'm sure there's plenty of spiritual phenomenon, haunted houses and vindictive or benevolent spirits doing their thing outside of Aang's purview or without need of the Avatar's intercession out there in the world that Mai can stumble upon.

Have Mai and Tom-Tom be traveling and find an abandoned mansion or shrine to stay the night in, just to find out there's an angry spirit haunting the place. Big enough to give Mai trouble but small time enough to not warrant or set of an alarm for the Avatar. It'd make a nice tribute to the Grudge or that one episode of Samurai Jack where he fought that dragon spirit in the haunted house.

Or maybe she finds a village where everybody's possessed or devil worshipers who want to sacrifice her.

>>112171

>Or maybe she finds a village where everybody's possessed or devil worshipers who want to sacrifice her.

I'm not sure there's any sort of devil figure in Avatar. We'll know more about vengeful spirits when Season 2 of Korra lands, but what little we know hasn't pointed to large scale spirit shenanigans or cults.

>>112172

>I'm not sure there's any sort of devil figure in Avatar.

Koh?

Of course, by "devil" I simply meant a malevolent spirit. I'm sure there's plenty of spirits in the Avatar universe that are vengeful, angry or just straight up dicks. There being an evil spirit with some kind of cult centered around it is certainly within the realm of plausibility when we have the spirits that will show up in Korra and guys like Koh creeping around the shadows. And Hai Bai was a pretty good spirit, but once he felt wronged, he turned into a monster.

Mai coming across some little town where everybody acts super strange, just to find out they venerate some wacked out spirit and want to kill her either because their patron spirit demands it or they are all possessed by it or both would feel right at home and add a little bit to the "goth" vibe Mai herself gives off. Or you could have Mai arrive in some town, feel something is off about the people there, and she finds out everybody in the town is actually dead. Do a big thing based on Japanese horror movies.

>>112173
For some reason that made me think immediately of Shadow Hearts, the 'cannibal village' you wander into at the start of the game.

>>112174

My mind started thinking about the zombie episode of Samurai Champloo.

>>112173
>Or you could have Mai arrive in some town, feel something is off about the people there, and she finds out everybody in the town is actually dead. Do a big thing based on Japanese horror movies.

I think there's something like that in a WoD splatbook. Somethign came through town, ate everybody's soul, so the town's spirit just upped and possessed all the corpses and kept 'em moving around as they would have done in life.

>>112176

It's something of a common horror scenario:

>Main character arrives in town/village
>People act weird
>Something supernatural is controlling them and is out to get MC.

You see that in a lot of stuff. I think it would be funny to see Mai get caught up in a classic horror movie style situation, just to see her completely unfazed and unfrightened by it all.

>>112178
this post is like literally the definition of "no fun allowed"

>>112178

>>112173
Fanfic rec out of the blue (it fits the discussion, kinda-sorta)
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6892379/1/Saving-Face

>>112189

>Nevertheless, she was regretting ever having stepped foot into this Agni-cursed forest.

I never understand why fanfics with Fire Nation characters always have to try to put the word Agni everywhere. The word itself means "fire: so while I understand they are trying to refer to the Hindu deity, it just sounds a little silly sometimes.

>>112195
It irritates me too. I understand why they use it, it's a replacement for where one would normally write God-whatever, like "godforsaken" or "goddammit". I've also seen a generic "spirits" used in place of "Agni".

The thing is, though, it's just lazy and awkward. And makes you sound a little ignorant of other religions, to a lesser extent. Come up with some different curses or interjections. Yeah, "monkey-feathers" from the show might sound too silly, but not much more than Agni-whatever.

>>112197
Yeah, plus in general Chinese "curses" or profanity tends to be less "blasphemous"/religious/spiritual, so inserting a God-analogue into phrasing for an exclamation makes less sense.

People should do their research:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mandarin_Chinese_profanity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cantonese_profanity

>>112198
Nice links. Don't speak/can't pronounce any Chinese to save my life, but I am familiar with some of these in passing, just from books I've read.

>>112197

I'd prefer they just use the word "god" or "spirits"

I don't mind fanfic writers using the word Agni. I just wish they would do so more cleverly.

Like in the series I'm trying to write for Mai, it's mentioned that one of the Fire Nation sacred scriptures are called the "Agni Veda." The word Veda means "knowledge" and is of course a reference to the sacred scriptures of Hinduism. Agni Veda translates into "fire knowledge" or "knowledge of fire." A little simple, but Avatar is a simple world.

For me, just replacing every instance of the word God or Christ with "Agni" is just lazy and uncreative and sounds very awkward when spoken aloud.

>>112197
Monkey-feathers also sounds like the kind of thing I could imagine a kid using, to avoid getting into trouble for actually swearing.

Replacing "God" with "Agni", though, is just silly. Especially since the Asian cultures that the Avatar world draws from doesn't have monotheistic religions.

>Especially since the Asian cultures that the Avatar world draws from doesn't have monotheistic religions.

That's not really relevant since there is still an understanding and worship of deities in those cultures. There's still a belief in gods, so the use of the word god in the form of a generic or proper noun I don't think is inappropriate. Avatar just avoids the designation of god in favor of the more general word "spirit." This is probably because the creators are a little uncomfortable devling into the concept of gods on a children's show, but doesn't want to break the mystical Asian aesthetic. The use of the word "God" though is not particular to monotheistic traditions since even polytheistic traditions are known to refer to "the gods" and "God" respectively.

Plus, there's also a Hindu influence to Avatar that is unmistakable and Hindus have their share of monotheistic traditions or at least understand there to be "the gods" and then "God," albeit within their own language and designations. You may have the belief in various lesser devas but then of course you also have the Supreme Godhead.

Not to mention Islam has been in East Asia for centuries (along with Christianity). The introduction of that monotheistic tradition to China happened within the first two centuries of the religion's founding in Arabia and little over 20 million people in China still practice it today. Plus, the majority of the world's Muslims are not in the Middle East but are actually in India and Indonesia. For many people and ethnic groups throughout Eastern and Southern Asia, Islam is their historical religion or at least one of them.

>>112214
I think it would be interesting worldbuilding if the Fire Nation only worshiped a single god/spirit, like the Egyptians did during the brief period they worshiped only Atum. Could help explain some of their national attitude, if they think their god is the best god and they're his chosen people.

>>112219
Considering it's technological might, and the Nation's decreasing respect for nature, I always figured it was more likely the case that the Fire Nation had begun to move way from the notion of spirits holding divinity, and started to focus far more strongly on historic figures.

>>112219
>>112223

wow, it's weird that you say that cause I actually created my own version of the FN's religion for that exact purpose and it was more or less how you described, a mixture of elements of Hinduism, Islam, Zoroastrianism and Buddhism. I had them come from a similar school of thought as the Air Nomads but were directly opposed to them in a number of ways that led to religious friction between the two. The Fire Nation sects believed in a powerful immaterial shapeless Cosmic Spirit who was the Supreme Sage or Para-Brahman and also believed the world they lived in was made to be a battleground between the spiritual forces of good and evil, which have shaped the very nature of living and inanimate things in the world, in addition to the world being a prison for human souls. They also believed in a successive order of sensual paradises awaiting man after the final battle against the evil powers of the world during a great day of reckoning. Paradises where people could enjoy the pleasures of the world without the fear of being able to abuse them. The Air Nomads, would have a more generally agnostic view on the great god-spirit, and would only believe in the existence of an Avatar Hades where souls of the dead slept awaiting their turn in the reincarnation cycle. The Fire Nation believed that a great rebirth would come one day in which the human souls would be freed from this cycle and the imperfect world, led by a great savior figure. The Air Nomads believed that freedom from the cycle could only be achieved through annihilation of the self through rigorous ascetic practice. The Fire Nation believed that everyone who, with passion and drive, strove to "do good," and "fight evil" would eventually be rewarded with freedom from the cycle of death and reincarnation, even if they didn't achieve annihilation (a state which FN groups believe lasts only as long as the god-spirit wills it). Struggle is the Fire Nation motto, not complacency. Passion, not apathy.

Indulge yourself a little now and then, they say, just beware of excesses. Enjoy the warmth of the flames of your passions, just don't get so swept up in them that the whole forest burns to the ground. Balancing things out with ascetic/religious ritual helps keep emotions in check and retain focus. This would be the traditional view among religious groups in the FN and the idea I had was that that these kinds of ideas set them at odds with the Air Nomads at times. I thought that maybe guys like Gyatso could've thought the Air Nomads might benefit from keeping a more open mind tho.

How does all this relate to Mai? Well, I was thinking that Mai's story could actually have her wanting to retreat. Maybe Mai wants to just "get away from it all" and is looking to escape from the world she hates with all its drama and stupidity that is just making her life worse. Her attitude could be "Forget my dad, forget Zuko, forget everyone and their problems, leave me out of it." Mai could slowly realize that she has responsibilities as an individual and as a human being and can't just run away from the world and sit and brood all day and night alone someplace far off for the rest of her life. So maybe she could slowly learn to reconnect to and find wisdom in her ancestral religion which she didn't take seriously growing up. She could also maybe argue a little with holy men, trying to justify her running away or her jaded personality by casually mentioning some proverb from the Agni Vedas about the bleak nature of the world, which a sage says she doesn't fully understand because of her cynicism. She could start burning offerings too.

Don't forget evolution of belief:
animism - polytheism - henotheism - monotheism

>>112229

The way I see it:

Fire Nation--Monotheistic
Earth Kingdom--Henotheistic
Water Tribes--Animistic (though they're all animists to an extent)
Air Nomads--Don't have an official position on gods

>>112235
If they're anything like real-life Buddhists they might be atheists who nevertheless hold certain species in non-worshipping reverence.

>>112236

It's not really fair to say Buddhists are atheists. The debate on the Buddha's views on God or gods is one that's been around for a long time. Generally speaking, Buddhism doesn't have an official position on the existence or nonexistence of gods. Buddhists though have often absorbed the local deities or eschatology of whatever culture they are in, following the folk religion(s) of the region, but applying a Buddhist philosophy and understanding to it. Some Buddhists believe in God, some don't, some believe in many gods, but Buddhism doesn't have an official position on whether God exists or not because it tends to deal more with questions on ethics than theology.

For the Air Nomads, I conceived them as having this position where they uphold animistic beliefs, I mean obviously they believe in the reality of the various spirits that inhabit the world like everyone else does, but didn't have an official position on the existence of a greater godly authority existing among the spirits, which lead to misconceptions of them being a godless people.

The Mai story I want to write would develop the Fire Nation's religious groups and kind of imply that some of Mai's apparent hatred of the world stems a little from traditional FN beliefs on the world's nature. Or at least that Mai has this dark and morose attitude towards the world and casually tries to justify it by appealing to Fire Nation religious beliefs when people give her flak about it, even though that isn't why she thinks that way. The idea I had was that the Fire Nation has never held the natural world in too high a regard because they believe it is "stained" imperfect and deceptive to the point where even certain spirits and celestial bodies are seen as wicked or ignorant powers trying to keep humanity imprisoned and certain animals and plants are seen as inherently impure, and which spirits and creatures are unclean, evil or ignorant would be a debate among the Fire Nation intellectual circles. So Mai's attitude towards the world, within this context, could be partly a result of religious ideals instilled in her as she grew up, along with past and recent experiences that have just made her more cynical. The traditional Fire Nation religion(s) would themselves be rather cynical faiths compared to those of other nations, but would also emphasize the good which can be seen through all the bad and the need to protect and uphold this good. Mai's issue would be that lately, she's having a lot of trouble seeing that good these priests and sages keep talking about.

It always struck me as a single-religion setting that was like a mix between Buddhism and Shintoism than any specific Earth religion. Buddhist-like traditions, but Shintoism-like cosmology, where it's full of "gods" (in this setting, just called spirits), but doesn't really seem to have a shared pantheon of extremely powerful gods that Western religions or even Hinduism would--basically just Genius Loci, Power Animals and Ancestor Spirits and things that tend to be known only to the local people.

But Tui and La were clearly treated in the manner not unlike the way Shinto Gods are--actual animals ascribed wondrous powers and shown reverence because they have spiritual significance to the locals. The fact that in this universe, they actually DO have wondrous powers, is interesting but not vital. It is unlikely that anyone outside the Water Tribe (and Aang, as the Avatar, and therefore a medium for ALL spirits), maybe even just the Northern Water Tribe, has any special reverence for them--but they would likely recognize them as the same sort of being as their own local gods.

Basically, I don't see the Avatarverse as being the sort of thing that has cults of worship for individual gods. The Avatar Spirit itself seems to be the closest thing in the setting to the traditional western concept of a god. But it doesn't seem to have any sort of cults of worship, either, except in the sense of Hero Worship or Cult of Personality--which seems to be directed more at the Avatars themselves than at the Avatar Spirit.

>>112242
>It always struck me as a single-religion setting that was like a mix between Buddhism and Shintoism than any specific Earth religion. Buddhist-like traditions, but Shintoism-like cosmology, where it's full of "gods" (in this setting, just called spirits), but doesn't really seem to have a shared pantheon of extremely powerful gods that Western religions or even Hinduism would--basically just Genius Loci, Power Animals and Ancestor Spirits and things that tend to be known only to the local people.

Long Feng mentions that the Earth King is a "god" to his people, using that exact word, so the concept of gods clearly exists in this world. If there are people who would see the Earth King as a god, literally, then for sure, given the daily reality of the spirits and their supernatural feats, some of the otherworldly spirits would be shown the same respect by some people. But it is also possible, in fact more than likely, that where one person might call this historic hero, king or this local spirit their "god," someone would disagree with giving that person/being this title, and they don't necessarily have to deny the existence of said spirit/human to say that they do not deserve to be called a god.

What I'm getting at is the people of this world's use of the word "god" would, reasonably, be more of a honorific they bestow on themselves or on spirits/persons they hold in a certain reverence, a more historical use of the word if you ask me. If they respect this entity enough or if they believe the entity possesses a certain amount of power and authority, then they will call that being a god, even if it is a fellow human. But some people might bestow the title of god more exclusively than others and certain humans or supernatural beings might feel themselves to be part of an exclusive elite in which only its members may have the right to be called "god" And some of them might even go so far as to claim they are the ONLY one that may be addressed as "god," putting them at odds with others who claim the same thing.

Just because everybody in this world accepts the reality of the spirits and the spirit world doesn't mean they all hold the same opinions as to the nature of this realm and its denizens and it's only realistic that the differences between the four nations would be more than superficial, but would also be political and religious and, honestly, only such differences would precipitate the need to maintain the separation.

At any rate, I think my new headcanon is that swearing in the Avatarverse takes the form of references to past Avatars, like "By Kiyoshi's giant clown shoes!" and "Aang's shiny dome!"

Getting back more to Mai, which is how this started. I think however you choose to imagine the Fire Nation's religious and spiritual beliefs, using Mai's traveling and going through an existential dilemma is a good excuse to develop the Fire Nation religious atmosphere.

I took some time a few days to start writing the episode synopsis for a "Mai series," just to see how many stories I could outline for Mai & Tom-Tom. I've gotten to episode 15 but I'm at a loss of where to go from there.

You see, I'm trying to come up with episode 16 and in it I wanted Mai to fall down a cliff and wake up in an alternate world. But I can't decide what kind of alternate world would make sense for Mai of all people to wake up in. The only thing I could come up with was the alternate Ty Lee Mai meets is actually the "goth" of the group, but that's it. Anyone have any ideas what kind of dream world Mai's mind would conjure up?

>>112237
From my, admittedly limited knowledge of it, what you're suggesting there for the FN sounds an awful lot like a purer form of gnosticism than what exists today.

>>112248

I was kinda thinking that their religion could be "gnostic" in some ways. I just hypothesized that the FN has always been a little antagonistic to the spirit world and the natural world around them, as well as the other nations, because of certain spiritual beliefs they have about these things. If they always believed the world was some sort of prison and that the spirit world we saw was a lower realm full of spirits whose mission was to keep them imprisoned, with the exception of their own patron spirits, and believed in attaining a certain state of perfection in defiance of spirits they consider oppressive, it would explain a lot in my opinion. Basically, the Fire Nation is the chosen nation by divine right and anyone who stands against it or the God or gods who support it is standing in the way of the enlightenment of mankind. As a result, the FN people kinda see things as Fire Nation vs "the world," and various spirits end up being ranked on a scale based on to what extent they stand in the way of the FN's vision of a perfect paradise. And by the time you get to Sozin, a radical trend has developed to where the FN thinks they need to wage all out war on these spirits and the humans who side with them, either converting them or destroying them, for the sake of religious enlightenment and societal progression. The Avatar could have been seen as imperfect, but a suitable mediator to the spirits in the past that war against unenlightened or oppressive spirits and the human beings who were loyal to them was not necessary.

Again, if this were how the FN views the world around them, a character like Mai developing this "hatred of the world," would have a religious justification or origin because in her culture, people are actually taught the world is something to struggle against and is not man's real "home." But Mai, like many in the Fire Nation, has probably taken some things to an extreme. You could use a story about Mai traveling the FN as a way of exploring the spiritual rut that most people in the FN during the Post-Ozai era are in.

Fun little thread on 4chan, roleplaying about a spinoff starring Mai and Tom-Tom in the style of >>112007

I'm pondering writing a oneshot or two from the episode guide.

>>112370
Lone Mai and Cub is the best thing 4chan has come up with in recent memory.

>>112372

>Lone Mai and Cub

I think you mean Lone Mai and Cub Assassin Scroll Champuru

>>112370

from the same thread

it's a pretty cool idea but the whole roleplaying aspect is a little too embarrassing.

>>112376

Who gives a shit? That thread's fucking hilarious. And if you don't think so, you have no fucking soul.

>>112376
Fuck you a million times.

>>112377
>>112378
well, okay. it's not like i took a huge dump on it, like i said it was a good idea. anyway, i'll leave you guys to it.

>>112388

Well, to be honest, that wasn't the first thread we've had before on a Mai spin-off, but the only reason such a story got so much collective development was exactly because people started roleplaying like it was real. Otherwise, I doubt that thread would still be up after five days unlike most character-centric threads on /co/ that just 404 after less than a day.

So you can knock everybody in that thread for roleplaying if you think that shit is for faggots, but at least people got shit done because the whole role-play encouraged them.

A fun thread, tapered at the end, but still good to the last post. Too bad the thread after it got trolled by a sagefag.


http://archive.foolz.us/co/thread/50616128

http://pastebin.com/4ner2LeS

>>112406
Man it makes me sad to comes across such dedicated assholes on the internet.

I mean what the hell was wrong with that guy? I think it would actually be more disturbing if he was sincere in his bizarre ranting rather than just a troll who liked to roleplay really hard.

>>112407

>I mean what the hell was wrong with that guy?

which guy?

>>112410
The guy in the second thread Mai thread on /co/ bitching at everyone for having fun writing fanfiction and telling them they would all be blacklisted by the comicbook industry for their sins, with sage on each post because the thread was "worthless shit"

>>112411

Oh, that guy. For a sec, I thought you were talking about me (season guide guy.)

>>112411
In any field of human endeavour you're always going to get 5edgy7u assmunchers who HATE EVERYTHING. I'm just grateful we had at least one complete thread of awesome stuff with everyone more or less on the ball.

>>112414

As a longtime participant and OP in Mai threads, I'm pretty sure that same guy's posted in nearly every Mai thread I've been in. I think every Mai thread he sees fills him with rage, but for some reason he subjects himself to the torture of them anyway, saging them up as he monitors them.

>>112415
Prolly just a mad Zutara shipper.

I just started looking into the comics lately.

Mai breaking up with Zuko annoys me, but on the other hand, Iroh sits on the burning throne and declares Tea Day, which may be all I have ever wanted.

>>112444

The guy actually, if he's the same anon I always encounter, is kind of an anti-shipper. He has this tendency to blame Mai's presence as a love interest or romantic partner for everything that was wrong with Zuko's character arc in the third season because it took time away from showing Zuko's relationship with Ozai and Azula.

Book 3 was chock full of useless episodes in general that could have been better spent on Zuko's family without taking out Mai or Ty Lee whose return and character developments, with Book 3 being as it is, are among the more positive traits of the season, adding more diversity to the Fire Nation cast. And Mai serves more of a purpose in the story as Zuko's love interest/savior and the one who begins pushing Azula over the edge than The Puppetmaster does in giving Katara bloodbending she's never going to use for anything important.

>>112447
Mai and Zuko breaking up didn't annoy me because I can see why - Zuko was being a paranoid and secretive dick (even more so than usual, at any rate) and Mai had finally had enough.

What really annoyed me in the Promise was how easily just about everybody was ignoring how fucked up Zuko was in the head. Only character besides from Mai who seemed to recognize it was Suki.

>>112451

>Zuko was being a paranoid and secretive dick (even more so than usual, at any rate) and Mai had finally had enough.

>What really annoyed me in the Promise was how easily just about everybody was ignoring how fucked up Zuko was in the head. Only character besides from Mai who seemed to recognize it was Suki.

Well, Suki was the only one aside from Mai who was there watching and observing Zuko at that time. Zuko was not exactly being open with everyone and was acting incredibly shady. When you're the son of a genocidal tyrant who was leading the country in a war of expansion and you agree to end the war and give back everything the country took once your father's enemies help you take the throne in a coup and instead you just suddenly call everything off and fortify yourself in one of those cities that you agreed to return, refusing to see or speak to any of your allies, it looks pretty bad. So I chalk that up to Zuko behaving like a complete moron. He doesn't let anyone know there's any problem and intentionally isolates himself cause "NO ONE CAN UNDERSTAND!" which just leads him to crawling back to Ozai like a dog anyway.

And Mai was putting up with this kind of crap for nearly year, despite everything she risked to help him. I don't think anyone can blame her if she just begins like this guy doesn't give a shit about her anymore and its better to leave than be associated with him as he chooses to let himself fall.

And it was kind of stupid for Zuko to not have asked Mai for help with the assassination attempts sooner, given she's probably a better body guard alone than most of the soldiers in the palace.

>>112453
The problem is that in the Promise, it's pretty clear that Zuko's mental state has been deteriorating over the course of the year and for the the others to have failed to notice that would mean they either hadn't been in contact with him or didn't care. The former's kind of difficult, because the Avatar world isn't so large that you can fail to hear about repeated assassination attempts made on the Fire Lord. The fact that Mai was comfortable asking Suki and the others to guard Zuko to me at least suggests that they were in semi-regular contact as well, and that they'd know as well - so it would be odd that word never reached the Gaang through her, either.

So, yeah - a good amount of his stress could have likely been alleviated if Zuko hadn't closed himself off, but that's a tendency of his that those around him should already be aware of, but it doesn't exactly seem as though the Gaang made much attempt to speak with him throughout that year either.

>>112466

On the other hand, they're still kids. It's hard even for adults to deal with loved ones having mental issues. I mean, look at some of their reactions to Azula in The Search; they don't really seem to get that she's irrational and in a very bad and confused mental state. Add to that that Zuko is a very closed off person. His obvious display of deterioration and stress could be very recent; some people are very good at hiding their mental distress.

I feel like a very vocal portion of the fandom possesses an unnecessary hatred of Mai. She's either seen as boring or is made out to be a bad girlfriend.

I've noticed people who hate Mai, and I mean really hate Mai, now seem to be:

1. Zuki shippers, probably former Zutarans, who believe Mai was a horrible girlfriend and now Suki will come in and cure all of Zuko's problems.

2. Anti-shippers. If it were up to these guys, Avatar would be a bland show with no romance or fun. For them, the greatest sin was giving Zuko a girlfriend because "ARRGH! Too much shipping in my cartoooons!" They exacerbate the role Maiko plays just because they hate seeing any teen or Y7 romance on the screen, even though Mai herself only takes up like little less 30 minutes of screen time in the whole season and most of Zuko's screen time is not spent with Mai.

There's some people who reasonably argue that Maiko took time away from having Zuko interact with Ozai. I understand this, but I think these same people are unwilling to say that a lot of the episodes with Gaang before the Black Sun Invasion were also unnecessary and thus took time away from that as well, more so than Zuko having a girlfriend character, just because they happen to like those episodes. But when you look at the bigger picture, those episodes tend to weaken the third season more than strengthen it.


Basically, I think Mai, as a character, sometimes ends up taking the heat for the poor writing of the third season, even though she's not a very important character. But she's a girlfriend character in a kids show and so when she shows up, you notice her.

>>112538
>but I think these same people are unwilling to say that a lot of the episodes with Gaang before the Black Sun Invasion were also unnecessary

In my experience, the majority who criticize the presence of Maiko in S3 because it detracted from the amount of focus that Zuko relationship with his family are generally willing to criticize those episodes as well - they don't seem to object to Mai and Maiko, so much as they feel that the Fire Nation characters in general needed greater focus in S3 (which tends to be a larger scale criticism, anyway).

Mai was dumb because the only way to know what the fuck was up with her and why she was suddenly Zuko's waifu was to read some side comic outside the show's story

And they had all of one scene together where they were being a semi happy teen couple and not at bored with/at eachother's throats so it was hard to believe it was really a relationship either had a vested interest in preserving

>>112538
Wait.

There are actually Zuki shippers?

Like honest to goodness 'I think they belong together" shippers? I thought they were all trolling.

>>112549
I want it to happen for the lulz.

>>112539

Really? Maybe I've been hanging around the wrong places.

I just feel like a lot of the people criticize Maiko for taking time away from developing Zuko's relationship with his family have a tendency to not levy the same criticism at episodes before the Black Sun Invasion (aside from The Painted Lady) that were just filler and gave characters development that never really played a role in the story. And the reason I don't think they offer the same criticism is simply because they "like" those episodes, even though they're pretty much just filler.

Like if they had taken just one of those episodes out and replaced it with a Zuko/Ozai/Azula centric episode, I don't think there'd be as many Mai haters if Maiko was the still exactly the same. I think there are some people who recognize that there IS indeed a problem with Book 3, but they don't want to admit that their favorite episodes are the problem simply because they found those episodes entertaining by themselves or they liked the concepts they introduced, even though the episode itself didn't need to be done and its time could have been used on something else that contributed more to the main plot. Because they are looking for something to blame, but don't want to admit their favorite episodes are the problem, they point the finger at characters like Mai or Ty Lee, who actually have a some stake in the plot, just a very small one.

>>112548

>Mai was dumb because the only way to know what the fuck was up with her and why she was suddenly Zuko's waifu was to read some side comic outside the show's story

her being shown to clearly have a crush on Zuko in the second season wasn't enough?

>And they had all of one scene together where they were being a semi happy teen couple

More than one actually.

>>112554

Same

>>112556
>her being shown to clearly have a crush on Zuko in the second season wasn't enough?

By clearly you mean one line of "you'd like to see Zuko again, wouldn't you?"

Seriously though, there really didn't seem to be anything about each other that the two actually enjoyed. Honestly, the only thing that Zuko and Mai actually seemed to connect on was their hate of Azula.

>>112557
At least twice in Season 2, the writers went out of their way to show that Mai had harbored a crush on Zuko in the past (in her first appearance in "Return to Omashu" and again in the flashbacks during "Zuko Alone"). Expecting nothing to come of that would have been silly, since if it had no bearing, it wouldn't have been included - though I will agree that the Zuko showed no on screen interest in her prior to the two hooking up.

That said, I can't really see where you're getting the idea that only thing they seemed to connect on being their mutual hatred for Azula. There are numerous times that the two are shown just spending time together throughout the the first half of Season 3, and the two are generally as happy as they ever are - Azula's only really mentioned when she, or something related to her, cuts their time together short.

>>112558
spending time together =/= connecting

I'm not saying there should have been broad declarations of love or whatever, but what about each other did the two love? There's nothing to their relationship other than making out.

>>112576
One would at least think they love the other for their shared traits, but I'd argue that the inability for somebody to answer that question is the result of a poor representation of the relationship (which makes sense, given how little of it is shown) ratehr than the relationship itself being a failure.

>>112406
Mai's awesome, this thread was awesome, glad it got archived. Too bad you can't look at the images since it just brings up a 404 if you click on them.

>>112823

I didn't draw these, but some drawfag on /co/ liked the ideas being dished in the Mai threads and drew some sketches.

>>112997

The shell shocked hermit Mai fights.

>>112998

>>112997
>>112998
>>112999
Awesome!

So there was a brief discussion on /co/ last night where anons were presented with a challenge: assemble a believable scenario where Mai and Ty Lee were the ones who discovered Aang instead and ended up helping his quest. If I remember some of the bullet points correctly:

>Aang is encased in volcanic rock instead of ice.
>100 years later, Ty Lee's circus sets up camp at the base of a dormant volcano
>Mai's family is vacationing in the same area so she goes to see Ty Lee
>When Ty Lee and Mai are hanging out, they stumble upon the mound Aang is buried under.
>Aang wakes up and the three become friends. Mai is suspicious of the Airbender.
>When Azula eventually shows up due to rumors of an Airbender going around, Ty Lee convinces Mai they should help their new friend.
>Azula recruits Zuko to help her hunt the trio down.

Admittedly, I like this concept, but it seems incredibly difficult to pull off. How do Katara, Toph and Sokka fit into this timeline? Do they even exist in this one? Or do they exist, but are different from before? Was Aang being encased in rock and discovered by Mai-Lee part of a series of alternate events over the last 100 years? You could probably only make it work that way unless you wanted to render Ty Lee and Mai's discovery of Aang irrelevant, I think.

>>113367
Or you could just recognize that, in this timeline, Sokka and Katara are irrelevant, and rewrite the series accordingly. Toph can still show up because she would probably be encountered regardless of which duo Aang teamed up with.

So who does Aang fall in love with in the end? Mai or Ty Lee?

>>113367

You don't really need Sokka, Katara, or Toph for a rewrite like this. In fact, I'd argue that trying to shoehorn them in typically reeks of plot railroading. "Damascus" by drakensis does a good job of avoiding this; with Toph as the Avatar and Mai as her companion. Katara, Sokka, and Hakoda don't even exist, because Gran-Gran Kanna was the previous Avatar who died childless. It opened up a lot of fun new situations, character interactions, and world-building options.

If you're going to have Mai and Ty Lee as Aang's main companions, the BIG concern is that you need to give them a reason for traveling with Aang and, ultimately, seeing to the overthrow of the Fire Lord and the defeat of their nation. That, and AU circumstances that shouldn't necessitate a change in their personalities.

Let me think over that /co/ synopsis. I like an AU challenge...

>>113368
>>113369

>Or you could just recognize that, in this timeline, Sokka and Katara are irrelevant, and rewrite the series accordingly.
>You don't really need Sokka, Katara, or Toph for a rewrite like this. In fact, I'd argue that trying to shoehorn them in typically reeks of plot railroading.

Not that I disagree here, but there's that pesky matter of Katara being the last known Waterbender in the South Pole. The problem is that if you visited her, if her circumstances were the same, it'd be hard to not have her join the trio. However, I think if you changed the timeline a little to where the Waterbenders in the South Pole did not suffer so much damage, then you could probably have Katara show up without her and Sokka having to join Aang. Having them not show up or mentioned but never explaining why kind of feels cheap. Toph, likewise, could show up in slightly different circumstances, but with her personality still intact. That's better than just not mentioning these characters, who were big deals in the canon and met Aang cause of "fate," for the sake of making the Aang-Mai-Ty Lee team up work.

If you ask me, the way I think how a story where Mai and Ty Lee discover Aang should be done is that the main Gaang should never grow too much larger than the original trio so that the relationship between these three is a central focus. Zuko and Toph could eventually join, though the circumstances of how and why may be slightly different, but the group should probably never get bigger than that.


>If you're going to have Mai and Ty Lee as Aang's main companions, the BIG concern is that you need to give them a reason for traveling with Aang and, ultimately, seeing to the overthrow of the Fire Lord and the defeat of their nation. That, and AU circumstances that shouldn't necessitate a change in their personalities.

When we were talking last night, the suggestion was made that Ty Lee and Aang become friends real quick and when Azula shows up and is like "Bring me the Avatar, now!" Ty Lee decides to help Aang. Mai is then put into a situation where she must choose between Ty Lee and Azula. So, the situation is that Ty Lee couldn't bring herself to let her new friend get hurt and makes a life changing decision to help Aang escape. Mai chooses to help Ty Lee instead of hurt her for Azula's sake or let Azula hurt her.

Given there's no set goal of going to the North Pole to train in Waterbending right away, the first few episodes would probably focus on the three just adjusting to life as fugitives until they figure out what to do. Both Mai and Ty Lee throughout the story ask themselves if they made the right decision and their friendship with Aang is tested by their ties to the FN and by Azula & Zuko. Ty Lee would probably feel like it was fate they and Aang met, while Mai would probably have more second thoughts about her decision as life on the run begins to get on her nerves. But the two would probably see how the war is affecting people and realize they, as FN citizens, have a responsibility to Aang and the world.

As to who Aang's love interest would be? My suggestion is to make it unclear who he likes more. When he first opens his eyes, he sees both their faces. Occasionally, he blushes around both of them. But he's afraid to lose either one. Things could get complicated though once Zuko is added into the mix. I could see Mai and Iroh being motivators for Zuko to break free from Azula eventually, but Aang might still worry Zuko's gonna "take one of his friends away," regardless of whether it is Mai or Ty Lee.

Aang, Mai and Ty Lee should have a wild threesome.

That is all.

>>113370

I get where you're coming from, but all that makes for an awfully boring retread of canon. Full series AU rewrites are a dime a dozen. Most of them stay on the canon railroad tracks. All that really seems to change is a bit of color in terms of dialogue, and even then it'd be Mai and Ty Lee conforming to Sokka and Katara's canon roles. Speaking personally, I'd rather go the "Damascus" route.

Go wild with the AU setting. Don't have Toph be Aang's teacher. Have Bumi. Or Haru. Or Haru's Dad. Or hell, Kori. Have Azula and Zuko chase after Aang not to capture him, but to protect him for some reason.

If you want to get really crazy, alter it so Azula and Zuko aren't royalty, or are royals with a lot less power than in canon. Like have Roku depose Sozin in the backstory, so their family line is a bunch of pretenders to the throne. With less ambitious wo/men on the throne, there's no Hundred Years War.

And that in turn offers other possibilities.

Without a war, Aang doesn't learn who he is until Age 16. It could be a young man that Ty Lee and Mai find buried in that volcano. That mixes up character dynamics quite a lot. Aang could be a little more mature, a little more accepting of his role of as Avatar. He and Mai could bond over their tired acceptance of the duties forced on them. And a love triangle is a lot more natural here: Mai is the girl for the solemn Aang-the-Avatar, while Ty Lee is the girl for the fun loving Aang-the-Air-Nomad.

The return of Sozin's Comet isn't necessarily a deadline here. We could stretch the story's timeline out further. We could also shift it so, say, the Day of Black Sun is the important deadline here. Like maybe the Sozinist pretenders to the throne are planning on launching a coup on that day. This could tie into Zuko's training with the dao, and Azula's friendship with Mai and Ty Lee. Their parents are training the would-be prince and princess as non-bender warriors who can fight and win their birthrights on the front lines during Eclipse Day. This gives a good reason why they want Aang neutralized before the eclipse -- having an Avatar around could give the non-Sozinist royal faction an ally in keeping/retaking "their" throne.

>>113375
The problem with AUs like that is that they're so far removed from the source material, they might as well just be OCDNS universes with characters that only marginally resemble anyone from the actual series. Plus it seems like a way for crackshippers to have a field day and warp character personalities even more than they already do.

I think >>113370 had the better idea.

>>113376
>Plus it seems like a way for crackshippers to have a field day and warp character personalities even more than they already do.
As if the core idea of this whole thing isn't already this.

A boring retread of the original is exactly that, a boring retread. The whole point of an AU (or fanfiction as a whole) is to take known characters and put them in a "what if" situation to see how they would cope with it. There's no point if all the character arcs are going to be the same as they were in the original.

It would be pretty cool, in this AU, if the fan theory that Ty Lee has Air Nomad heritage was made canon. It would bond her more closely to Aang if she learned it, and through her curiosity we could learn more about the Air Nomads.

>>113384

>Dormant Air Bender Ty Lee

I can dig it.

>>113375

While I myself am all for switching up other parts of the timeline, afterall if Aang's means of imprisonment changes then there isn't any reason it couldn't be part of a greater chain of alternate events, like >>113376 said, you want to avoid making these established characters too OC.

What I was suggesting though, primarily, was that it seems a bit cruel to just ignore let's say Sokka and Katara completely, given their importance in the original timeline, and that at the very least they should show up in some different, but still recognizable, incarnation. But in order to avoid a retread of canon, I also suggested that the core of the Gaang should always be that triangular relationship between Aang and his two girlfriends, so much so that the "Gaang," refers generally to that trio and maybe Aang never has one person helping him learn the elements. Sure, I think Zuko, Toph, and maybe Katara should become friends or allies to our three heroes, maybe teaming up now and again to put a stop to Azula or some other threat or help Aang with his training (which he could be getting from a number of tutors in his travels), but the only permanent members of the Gaang should be Aang, Ty Lee and Mai.

I gave some thought to this timeline last night and came up with several things that might make for an interesting story:

>Aang is discovered a full year before Sozin's Comet arrives, allowing the trio more time to figure out what to do while still remaining the same ages.
>The Southern Water Tribe was less devastated by the war. Instead, the damage was more evenly distributed between the two tribes and the Earth Kingdom received a couple heavier blows. Some Waterbenders still remain in the South, though their numbers are dwindling. Katara is Master Hama's star pupil. Kya is still alive. And Chief Hakoda never left to fight in the Earth Kingdom, but stayed to help protect his home from Fire Nation raids.
>Meanwhile, in the North Pole, Chief Arnook is killed by the Fire Nation and is, in an unprecedented event, succeeded directly by Princess Yue.
>In the Earth Kingdom, Toph Beifong is orphaned, her parents also killed by the Fire Nation, and is now leader of The Freedom Fighters.
>Azula, after the betrayal of Mai and Ty Lee, takes it upon herself to join Zuko's crew on his ship, dangling the news of the Avatar in front of him. Zuko agrees to let Azula join his search, on the condition that they do things "his way." Azula condescendingly agrees. Both Zuko and Iroh are suspicious of Azula's motives, not yet knowing about Ty Lee and Mai's betrayal.
>As the story progresses, Azula attempts to assert herself as Zuko's main adviser, trying to undermine Iroh's influence on him at every opportunity.
>With every failed attempt to capture the Gaang Trio, and to assert her control once more over Mai and Ty Lee, Azula's behavior becomes more and more disturbing to Zuko, especially after one such attempt where her face is permanently scarred by one of Mai's knives.
>After Mai scars Azula, she slowly she begins to have the Ursa hallucinations. These start out weak at first but get stronger as the story reaches its conclusion. On top of these, however, Azula sometimes sees Mai and Ty Lee in these visions "mocking her," as she sees it.
>Queen Yue, who has established contact with the Southern Tribe once again after years of disconnection, is at a crossroads when an outrageous plan is suggested by Master Hama to win the war once and for all, a plan that could end in more than half the Fire Nation under water. Yue, however, doesn't like the idea of potentially killing innocent civilians but fears that unless the Fire Nation is stopped before the Comet arrives, there will be no choice left to save her people and she'll have to let the plan go through. She summons Aang and begs him to find a way to stop the War before that happens.

So, we could have a slightly more formidable Water Tribe and a slightly more weakened Earth Kingdom.

>>113396

cont'd

In this timeline, a recurring theme can be the idea of making choices between two people or two opposite forces, Yin and Yang and facing the choice between more of one or the other, and yet the decision one makes as to who/which they prefer may come with its fair share of consequences and benefits. It starts out with Ty Lee choosing to help her new friend Aang over following Azula's orders, which is then immediately followed by Mai being put into a position similar to Ty Lee's in the canon, where it's either one friend or the other, with Mai choosing Ty Lee because Ty Lee's not a bitch. As a result, they both become the most wanted fugitives in their country. From that point, the two can also act as Yin & Yang for Aang, sometimes presenting two very different suggestions/ideas/perspectives in which there isn't an easy way for Aang to find a compromise between the two, but Aang kind of needs both their influences in order to remain properly balanced and the two girls can learn to be more balanced themselves in their own points of view. But Aang could also be faced with very serious choices, not just small ones. Maybe at one point, Azula tries to make Aang choose which one he wants to live more than the other. He also could grow very dependent on both of them and have to learn that they won't always be there for him or that he can't always be the center of their lives. When Zuko eventually changes sides and the romance between he and Mai starts, this could really upset Aang, not simply because he might want to fuck Mai himself at that point, but mostly because he sees Mai and Ty Lee as kind of like big sisters and Zuko's over stayed welcome has the potential to fuck up this little family unit Aang has created for himself. And of course if Zuko was responsible for one or both of them getting hurt in the first place, Aang could have trouble trusting Zuko from the beginning, which isn't too hard for Mai and Ty Lee to do since they know Zuko quite well.

On Zuko's end, the theme of Zuko's struggle with good and evil is still there but goes with that recurring theme of two people telling you to do two different things, each of which with their own benefits. Aang has Mai and Ty Lee, who often have different interests and ideas that call for Aang to find a balance, but Ty Lee and Mai are generally good, regardless of their very opposite personalities or their character flaws. Zuko, however, has Iroh on one shoulder and Azula on another from pretty much the very beginning of the story, both competing for influence over him, with one being more evil than the other. Iroh offers advice as to the most ethical decisions, but Iroh's way may not be as quick or efficient in achieving their shared goals as what Azula is suggesting, which are often morally questionable methods but almost always guarantee success.

Having a slightly more powerful Water Tribe than Earth Kingdom also adds to that Yin & Yang deal, as Aang must prevent both the Fire Nation and the Water Tribes from causing massive destruction.

>Azula, after the betrayal of Mai and Ty Lee, takes it upon herself to join Zuko's crew on his ship, dangling the news of the Avatar in front of him. Zuko agrees to let Azula join his search, on the condition that they do things "his way." Azula condescendingly agrees.
Why would Azula ever stoop to taking orders from Zuko by joining his crew? Either she'd haul in the resources of the Fire Nation like the Rough Rhinos or she'd just force Zuko to follow her which she could very easily do.

>He also could grow very dependent on both of them and have to learn that they won't always be there for him or that he can't always be the center of their lives.
Please no. I know Aang has some moments of selfish attention-seeking, but he has always had an independent streak. He's the pinnacle of the airbenders and freedom, I'd have a hard time believing he'd grow dependent of anyone even if this is an AU.

>Iroh offers advice as to the most ethical decisions, but Iroh's way may not be as quick or efficient in achieving their shared goals as what Azula is suggesting, which are often morally questionable methods but almost always guarantee success.
lol

>>113426


>Why would Azula ever stoop to taking orders from Zuko by joining his crew? Either she'd haul in the resources of the Fire Nation like the Rough Rhinos or she'd just force Zuko to follow her which she could very easily do.

Since when has Azula ever tried ordering Zuko around? She's never been shown to do that. Her specialty is manipulating him to make the choices she wants him to make, either so he acts in her best interest or so he falls into her traps. Azula has never tried to assert control over Zuko. She tells lies and half truths and dangles just the right bait in front of him. That's how she controls him. If she showed up and said she was going to join Zuko's crew and Zuko said "Only if you understand I'm in charge of this ship," it'd be well within her established personality to just go "Pfft, fine whatever, Captain, I'll just make you dance the way I want you to dance anyway."

>Please no. I know Aang has some moments of selfish attention-seeking, but he has always had an independent streak. He's the pinnacle of the airbenders and freedom, I'd have a hard time believing he'd grow dependent of anyone even if this is an AU.

Did you not watch Bato of the Water Tribe when Aang crumpled up a letter from Sokka and Katara's own father because he was scared that they might leave him? Or The Guru when Aang was unable to "let go" of Katara? Or how he behaved when Appa was lost? Or in The Avatar State when the General used Katara and Sokka to unlock the Avatar State? Or even how he ran away from the Air Temple in the first place because the Council was going to take him away from his beloved master and best friend? Aang is scared to lose his friends and those he cares about and can get very emotional or just irrational when he feels they have been or may be taken away from him. I don't see how in a universe where Mai and Ty Lee aren't just Aang's companions, but his ONLY companions besides Appa, Aang would not have a fear that these two friends of his, who he cares about very deeply, might leave him or be taken from him by some force or circumstance beyond his control. He wouldn't want to be separated from Mai or Ty Lee in this universe any less than he'd want to be separated from Katara or Sokka or Gyatso or even Appa.

>lol

This isn't really an argument to respond to, but I'll just say that Iroh is kind of person who is willing to not steal a charitable family's ostrich horse and is perfectly willing to go through the extra effort of walking on foot instead of stealing one. Azula, however, would probably suggest stealing the ostrich horse so as to avoid having to waste time walking.

So in this Mai/Aang/Ty Lee universe, would Mai/Aang actually be endgame, would it be Ty Lee and Aang or would Aang by some strange twist of fate still end up with Katara and Mai still with Zuko?

Some people have wondered before "How would Aang deal with Katara choosing Zuko?" A universe like this could give a much more plausible scenario where Aang's love interest rejects him. Or maybe Aang ends up with Mai and Ty Lee ends up with Zuko here?

>>113698
Well it depends on who he meets first, right? That's how it worked with Katara. He loved her from the moment he set eyes on her.

>>113698
Well it depends on who he meets first, right? That's how it worked with Katara. He loved her from the moment he set eyes on her.

>>113704
>>113705

Well, I think logically, Ty Lee would probably be the one who wakes up Aang, but just having Aang see Mai or Ty Lee first and being like "okay, that's the love interest," just seems boring and a little too much like canon. When I picture Mai and Ty Lee finding Aang, I picture both of them standing over him and when he opens his eyes, he sees two pretty young girls staring down at him.

From there, you can have it practically anyway you want. Aang could end up Ty Lee or Mai or both or neither.

I like the thought of Mai being tsundere for Aang's shiny dome, but still liking Zuko. A love square is fully possible too.

>>113707
Well it all boils down to whether Aang is more apt to be attracted to someone like him or unlike him.

Because that's the dichotomy between the two girls. Ty Lee is very much like Aang: she's light and bubbly and carefree. You can almost take her as an example of what Aang would be like without the weight of being the Avatar on his shoulders. I can picture Aang and Ty Lee getting along incredibly well, their mutual enthusiasms feeding off each other into hyperactive fits of glee.

Mai, meanwhile, is dour and gloomy and firm, almost as far from Aang's personality as you can get. And I think Aang would appreciate that. Katara is a foil to Aang, but Mai is a more stark one, and they would clash, but Aang would also come to respect her deeply. And I think Mai would appreciate someone bringing a little sunshine into her life.

I think you're right that it could go either way, because both girls present a different choice, and Aang would find both choices appealing. Instead of having a surefire romance like Aang and Katara, I can see a genuine tossup playing out across the story, with Aang shifting his affections between Mai and Ty Lee more than once.

>>113711

>I can picture Aang and Ty Lee getting along incredibly well, their mutual enthusiasms feeding off each other into hyperactive fits of glee.

And then of course Mai has to play mommy to the two. I think Aang would enjoy a playmate because if you look at Aang's relationship with Katara over the course of the show. There were plenty of times when Aang and Katara were the irresponsible ones and Sokka had to be the parent figure. In this case though, Ty Lee would more overwhelmingly be the "fun one," who is probably less serious than even Aang is.

Aang could like Ty Lee's outgoing personality and dislike Mai's killing the mood with her gloom, sarcasm, and common sense, but there could be times where even he agrees Ty Lee needs to get a clue, and maybe those moments help him appreciate Mai more when Mai isn't being a bitch to him or hating fun.

>Instead of having a surefire romance like Aang and Katara, I can see a genuine tossup playing out across the story, with Aang shifting his affections between Mai and Ty Lee more than once.

Yeah, if this were the real show, you'd probably have episodes that sometimes center more on Aang's relationship with each one, kind of leaving the audience in some real suspense as to who Aang will eventually end up with. Then Zuko comes along and starts ruining the fandom's ships.

>>113716
Of all the Avatar Elseworlds that have been proposed, this is rapidly becoming my favorite. It's just so neat.

Well, second favorite, I don't think I'll ever love anything more than Wolfbatman.

>>113717

>Of all the Avatar Elseworlds that have been proposed, this is rapidly becoming my favorite. It's just so neat.

I think it definitely has a lot of potential.

You have Mai, who plays the role of the character who apparently doesn't like the hero but is revealed over time to care. Ty Lee, the naive and gullible character who still has a lot to learn about the world and Aang is still well, Aang. There's a lot of what made Sokka, Katara and Aang a great dynamic in there, but also a lot of new things that you wouldn't have found in that trio.

One thing is that not only is Aang a little clueless about the war, but so are probably Mai and Ty Lee to a certain extent, having never quite left the Fire Nation or seen the real face of the war and were raised with the Fire Nation propaganda, so Aang isn't the only who's going through the ordeal of experiencing a different world. Both Mai and Ty Lee are having to deal with living with and interacting with and sometimes even depending on people they've been raised with as either "the enemy," or as their lessers. Both Ty Lee and Mai though could have different kinds of reactions based on their personality's. Maybe Ty Lee cares a little more than Mai about the fact that people don't like the the Fire Nation.

With Azula, I wonder if there could be a little Azulaang hinted with her having a homicidal obsession with Aang.

>>113711
>Because that's the dichotomy between the two girls. Ty Lee is very much like Aang: she's light and bubbly and carefree. You can almost take her as an example of what Aang would be like without the weight of being the Avatar on his shoulders. I can picture Aang and Ty Lee getting along incredibly well, their mutual enthusiasms feeding off each other into hyperactive fits of glee.

She acts similarly, but Ty Lee doesn't have the moral core that Aang does. She seems to have fun capturing prisoners, rendering people helpless, burning down houses, ect.

>>113725

I don't think Ty Lee enjoys these things in a sadistic sense. I think she doesn't understand the seriousness of these things. For her, it's all just fun and games, but she's not the type to enjoys seriously hurting or tormenting people.

That could be a thing. She helps the Avatar, but doesn't understand what a huge deal that is. She sees people hate the Fire Nation but doesn't understand why.

>>113725
>>113726
It's also important to keep in mind that from her perspective as a Fire Nation citizen, she actually is one of the good guys--remember that the popular propaganda that they teach children in the Fire Nation is that they're trying to bring civilization and technology and the other unique benefits of the Fire Nation to the barbaric world. When a normal Fire Nation soldier engages an enemy, they're going to see them as people who are trying to keep the rest of the world from receiving the benefits of living in the Fire Nation.

Now, obviously they should know better in real world terms--they wear pointy armor, many of the rank and file have dehumanizing skull masks, and their leaders are pretty much exclusively assholes other than Iroh. But like any other army in the world, they're convinced that they're the good guys in the fight.

So it's not so much that Ty Lee doesn't have a moral core as that she thinks she's doing what's right. When she's fighting enemy soldiers and having fun doing it, it's the same from her perspective as when Aang playfully sidesteps Fire Nation goons and laughs while doing it--they both have that childlike glee and devil-may-care attitude in a fight because they have the confidence that comes from being nigh-untouchable kid heroes in their own minds.

>>113727

I kinda picture a scene where Ty Lee hears some people talking bad about the Fire Nation and she starts spouting a bunch of propaganda.

>The Fire Nation is the greatest civilization the world has ever known! WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?
>Ty Lee...you're drawing a crowd.

>>113720
I don't know about anyone else, but I always found the idea of Azula having a massive lust for Aang due to his avatar status/genes to be very enticing

>>113730
If this hypothetical show doesn't have any content restrictions, there needs to be an episode where Ty Lee comes across something truly horrific that the Fire Nation has done, and can't believe it.

Maybe even Mai would be shocked by what they found. Maybe it would be something like a mass grave or a slave labor camp. It would shake both of them and leave them questioning everything they thought they knew about the Fire Nation.

>>113754

The Southern Air Temple. Canon Fire Nation Propaganda is that they defeated the nonexistent Air Nation Army.

>slave labor camp

So, the off-shore prison for Earthbenders?

>>113755

I agree that there's no real need to boost the content. The Southern Air Temple and Aang's story contradicting what they were told would be enough to at least get them to start thinking twice.

>>113755
>>113757
How on earth are Mai and Ty Lee going to calm Aang down, though? Katara used their mutual histories of loss to get through to him. Neither of the Fire Nation girls have anything like that.

>>113758

Maybe they reassure him by telling him that they'll help him search for any remaining Airbenders and they got his back?

The visit to the Southern Temple could have a little argument where Mai's like "there are no Airbenders left." And maybe by the end she's like "Well, okay, if you survived, MAYBE there might be others," just to give Aang a little hope.

>>113370
Why not just have Mai help Aang because she wants to help Zuko capture the avatar? She could feel conflicted about having to betray Aang to help Zuko.

>>113769
That sounds like it could be great. And then we could have TWO 'betrayals': Mai betraying Zuko to stay loyal to Aang, and eventually Zuko betraying Azula to help out Aang, Mai and Ty Lee.

The first one could come at the end of Book 1, when the Fire Nation attacks the Northern Water Tribe.

>>113769

I have no problem with Mai being tempted to just turn Aang in or tying this perhaps into the romantic tension that would inevitably exist between Zuko and Mai (which Azula would definitely try to use to regain her control over Mai). But I think having a double betrayal is just too convoluted imho.

>>113773

Rather, it needs a new Maizula thread.

http://archive.foolz.us/co/thread/53789506/

>>113780
Fun to see the idea spreading. If we could actually get a script together for an episode, I wouldn't mind trying my hand at drawing some of it. Keep in mind I wouldn't want to commit to anything like a whole comic, but drawing a page for fun might be keen.

>>113785
I'll give it a go. Why not? I'm between projects at the moment, and I need to improve my screenwriting.

http://archive.foolz.us/co/thread/53789506/

I wrote some of the dialogue pieces in this thread. Plan to do more soon.

http://korraquality.tumblr.com/post/57750821773/mai-was-always-my-favorite-minor-character-and

It kind of reminds me of >>111799

http://archive.foolz.us/co/thread/54075561/

this thread had a lot of great ideas. It also contains a list of all the different stuff that people came up with in the previous threads as well as a basic outline of the first half of the first episode.

At the end we started to discuss Katara's role in the story and how certain events lead to her becoming a kind of traveling collector of scrolls and books. We also talked about the concept of a Fire Nation uprising and Aang's friendship with Mai, Ty Lee and eventually Zuko could play into that.

>>114050
We don't really need this here, it looks like something a Zutard would use to point out how lame and immature they think Kataang/Maiko fans are.

>>114061

It's making fun oh How I Became Yours.

>>114107
It was hard to tell. It's certainly better drawn, for one thing. And I wouldn't think the bit at the end with Zuko would be included.

Beautiful pic, and check out the description too.

http://kelly1412.deviantart.com/art/Royal-Mai-Four-Chinese-characters-series-272147028

Found a new piece

>>115661

>>115662

So I was thinking of making a tumblr for the Mai/Aang/Ty Lee AU discussed here and on /co/? Would anyone be interested in helping out with it?

>>115691
Helping out in what way?

>>115698

Well it could use a couple active followers once I finish it. People who'd actually contribute content and criticism.

>>115691
>the Mai/Aang/Ty Lee AU discussed here and on /co/
Do tell.

>>115701

You can find everything archived here in this thread (scroll up), but to recap: Aang is sealed away in the Fire Nation instead of the South Pole, Mai and Ty Lee find him, they become friends, through a strange twist of events they end up joining Aang on his adventure and Azula tries to hunts them down.

>>115702

>tries to hunts them down

You enjoyed Doomstar too then?

Bumpy