>>84631
See, I don't really think that's fair. You can't really blame Mike and Bryan for Zutarans being the aspergers sufferers of the Avatar fandom.

Let me explain.

You know how you tend to give your friends shit. Like, you'll call them up if they're late for something (like meeting for dinner or a movie or whatnot), and you'll say something like "Hey assface, were the fuck are you!?"

You're not saying that to be mean of cruel, You're just giving your buddy a bit of shit and joking around with them.They understand that you don't really dislike them, or disrespect them. They understand that you don't really think they're an 'assface'.

Problem is, if you have a friend that has aspergers (which, for those who don't know, is basicly a form of social retardation in which you just don't "get" basic social interactions) they could end up getting offended at your "assface" remark. Thinking that you really do hate them and, in fact, think you have a face that resembles an ass. They then hang up on you and don't communicate with you again for three months because they honestly didn't get that you where just having fun with them in a friendly way and took honest offense to what you said.

That's basically the relationship Mike and Bryan have with the Zutarans. They're just giving them some shit, having a laugh with them that any rational human being would "get" and laugh along with them.

In other words...

It's not Mike and Bryan's fault that Zutarans aren't rational reasonable human beings that don't understand either basic fundamental human interactions or humor.

>>84631
Even Mike and Bryan troll the Zutards. Where is your argument now?

>Zutara
Ember Island Players man, its all Ember Island Players

>>84631

Well, sometimes we get tired of being obligated to take the moral high road. Why should we have to stand there and take their shit because if we defend ourselves we'll "look bad"? It's not our fault they're a bunch of manipulative crybabies who live and die by the Wounded Gazelle Gambit.

You know who I just don't get? Dietotaku. I browse around CAPSLOCK: ATLA on LiveJournal and I see her post a lot; ninety percent of the time, she acts exactly like everybody else there. She likes the show, she likes making fun of the show, she makes funny stupid jokes, and she generally gets along with everybody. Now and then she'll mention enjoying Zutara but that's certainly not a crime. Then out of nowhere she'll say something like, "In my headcanon Aang couldn't please Katara sexually and was oblivious so she sneaked off to have buttsex with Zuko every night." Or she'll compare Bryke making Kataang canon to them pissing in her cereal. Or she'll say any number of other irrationally spiteful things. What the fuck? How is it that someone can act so lighthearted and friendly one minute suddenly enter bitchmode at the drop of a hat? It all confuses and angers me and it sours my view of her even when she's being nice.

>>84844
I don't think we'll ever understand Dietotaku. I mean, she's one who was able to fanwank about fucking My Little Ponies.

>>84848
>fucking My Little Ponies
Geeze. I mean, I knew her sexual interests might be a little twisted, seeing as she likes Zutara, but wow. This one takes the cake. Yes, I know exactly what you meant. I am deliberately twisting your wording for my own sick amusement.

>>84844
>>How is it that someone can act so lighthearted and friendly one minute suddenly enter bitchmode at the drop of a hat?

Never been married, right?

Girls, man, girls make strong emotional relationships around concepts and have a wider perception of emotional nuances.

We guys don't get it because we don't put that much emotional investment in stuff. On the other hand, that helps cope with frustration.

There's scientific research explaining the subject but you can figure out how these conducts would've appeared as adaptative tools for survival to our species...

Pro tip: Stay away from fangirls, they can drive you crazy if you don't know where to draw a line. Fanboys are just as obnoxious, but it's easier to ger rid of them of they don't go away by themsleves.

>>84864
>gender stereotypes
lol

>>84867

>gender stereotypes that just happen to be 100% accurate in this situation

lol x2

>>84874

>>84844

Seriously. I've seen her act like a normal person to the point where sometimes I wanna like her a little, but no amount of funny or easygoing can erase the discomfort I feel every time I see her username. I just know her too well for being a screaming douchebag Zootard.

>>84874
Nope, nuh-uh. Not at all.

>>84874
Eh, I was under the impression that capslock was mostly females anyway. So you can't really explain one user's irrational behaviour as LOL WOMEN.

>>84878
>> So you can't really explain one user's irrational behaviour as LOL WOMEN.

That's why the explanation applies to more people than just one.

>>84844

Seriously. She's usually a pretty great member of capslock_atla--funny, makes clever posts, blah blah blah. But like, when the Korra thing came out, that she was Aang and Katara's kid? It's like an entirely new person emerged from the easygoing fan we normally see, this completely rabid, bitter, insult-flinging shipper. It's just so Jekyll and Hyde, especially because she's not just a Zutarian who, you know, enjoys the pairing, pokes fun at canon, etc...she takes it all the way there. Like, full-on insulting Bryke, loves to nurse her own imagined wounds because bawwww Kataang and Maiko, lashes out at people pointing out her batshittery...it's weird.

>>84893

I wonder what goes on tbrough her head. Shit, I wonder what her reacton was to them confirming it and saying that Katara being the mother was obvious. Oh wait, she probally chalked it up to Mike and Bryan failing at romance and rubbing the ending in her face (when really it's more like Mike and Bryan are doing what they always do and she's rubbing her own face in her own issues.)

Slight correction, though. Korra is the new Avatar, and Aang's reincarnation. Tenzin is Aang and Katara's son.

>>84890
>>other females there don't act like that.

But they do. I knew someone who is a Sokkla shipper, and I had to stop talking to her for that reason. One moment she'd be all nice and reasonable, until the moment Tyzula or the finale was mentioned, she became the "rabid, bitter, insult-flinging shipper."

>>84896

Oh, dur. Thanks for the correction.

>>84899
>rabid sokkla shipper

That sounds like a unique and strange beast. Clearly she must represent females everywhere.

>>84899

Do you happen t'mean the rabid Sokkla shipper that was defending Jackie Diaz on her page? Serious, hardcore Sokkla shippers are pretty rare, you never know.

There was a hardcore Sokkla shipper on capslock_atla that started bitching about capslock always making Azula gay when someone edited some HIBY pages and ended with Azula demanding a threesome with Mai and Ty Lee.

>>84906
I'd be demanding threesomes with Ty Lee and Mai, too, if I had to deal with HIBY!Sokka. They're manlier than he.

>>84906

Yeah, nayara_malfoy/neuron_muerta. She also bashed on Suki and Ty Lee a lot. (Though after talking to her via PM several months back to clear up a misunderstanding on F!S she proved herself to be slightly more mature than I gave her credit for. At least enough to have a serious discussion and sort stuff out.)

>>84904
that was just one example, try telling any Death Note fangirl that DN is a predictable and boring manga.
You don't even need to mention how Gary-Stu the protagonist is to get them rabid-angry.

>>84910

Hardcore fanboys are just as crazy retarded - just about different things.

>>84914
That was exactly my point:

>>Fanboys are just as obnoxious, but it's easier to ger rid of them if they don't go away by themselves.

>>84917

You've honestly never run into any obnoxious fanboys who never shut the hell up over whatever trivial bullshit they're completely obsessed about? Just look at the creepier sci-fi and comic fanboys. This expands to outside of fandom - Glenn Beck will never shut up with his obnoxious dumbassery no matter how much we wish he would.

Insane, never-ending obnoxiousness is not at all limited to women.

>>84914

Hardcore stat fanatics on gaming forums. That is all.

>>84918
Yes, I have, but it's always been easier (to me) to get rid of them than the girls. With the guys is usually "hey man it's OK but I don't care, nothing personal" and that's it, but with girls it most likely ends with drama and them insulting me and stuff.

But that's my personal experience, y'know? I don't know yours but you seem to know more male fans than I do so you're probably right.

Then again:
>>Insane, never-ending obnoxiousness is not at all limited to women.
Agreed. I never intended to say otherwise, sorry if it seemed so.

>>84910

Man, I'm not really a big DN fan, but wasn't the protagonist pretty clearly laid out as an insane, inhuman, god-complexed monster? I wouldn't call that a Gary Stu. Good lucks and smarts does not a Gary Stu make.

>>84925

>Yes, I have, but it's always been easier (to me) to get rid of them than the girls. With the guys is usually "hey man it's OK but I don't care, nothing personal" and that's it, but with girls it most likely ends with drama and them insulting me and stuff.

I actually have an easier time blowing off rabid fangirls than rabid fanboys. Maybe it's just a communication thing since I'm a chick.

>Agreed. I never intended to say otherwise, sorry if it seemed so.

No problem. I was just reading through some sexist shit on another site, so I was being over-testy about it out of irritation. My apologies as well.

>>84925
It's hard not to sound sexist when you start off with, "Never been married, right?" and go on to cite how cavewoman genes make girls all touchy-feely.

Anyway, my point is that Dietotaku is visibly a aberration among the other members of that particular online community. If she were nothing more than another rabid Zutarian who couldn't shut up about it, I'd just write her off as another crazy. But the fact that she's normally so agreeable but prone to bouts of incredible venom just fizzles my brain.

Also, she's said that Aang's a pussy for not sacrificing his values and killing Ozai (thus insulting both Batman and Superman by extension) and claims that the big man's just as dangerous behind bars. Maybe someone can dredge up one of her rants, but that makes no sense to me. Ozai possesses no political power, poses no physical threat, and is very unlikely to ever escape. Sure, there must be loyalists, but wouldn't they still be a problem even if he died? I fail to see her reasoning.

>>84926
>> Good lucks and smarts does not a Gary Stu make.

No, but having the writer make up rules and twisting the context's laws so the protagonist always gets away with everything does.

You know, like in Twilight.

>>84932
That falls under the grounds of smart. He not a gary stu at all, he's a fucking monster, but a smart one.

>>84933
Smart how? I mean, I read the thing until the time skip and him being "smart" was based all around everyone else being plain idiots, and the writer filling in with deus-ex-machina rules and more rules and more rules to give him advantages whenever he was in a dead end.

You can't tell me losing and recovering memory at will is not a Gary-Stu-level power.

>>84933
>>he's a fucking monster, but a smart one.

Shhh. Don't talk about me.

Ever notice that whenever someone's trying to convince someone else that a certain character in a "Sue" they only list the characters positive characteristics and completely ignore any and all of the negative in order to prove their point.

>>84941
So your entire concept of Sueness revolves around the powers they have? That's sensical and wise.

>>84943
We're talking about a guy who is not only supposedly "super brilliant" but also a "tennis super star" for a single chapter just for the sake of showing off, who ends being a "god" at the end of the story.

Yep, totally not Bella Swan.

>>84944
>>So your entire concept of Sueness revolves around the powers they have?
Nah, it's more like:
a fictional character with overly idealized and hackneyed mannerisms, lacking noteworthy flaws, and primarily functioning as a wish-fulfillment fantasy for the author or reader. Perhaps the single underlying feature of all characters described as "Mary Sues" is that they are too ostentatious
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_sue

But in DN case having the author making up complex and contradictory rules that came up whenever Light needed them was a huge turn-off. Light didn't take advantage a of set of existing rules and avoided the risks of dangerous rules, but instead we had the author introducing more and more positive rules to counter any negative rules whenever a dead end was reached on his story, and later abandoning rules that were not longer needed.

It'd be like having J.K. Rowling make spells up exclusively for Harry that only Harry can perform and that counter and/or surpass any other spells anyone else could do because Harry's not only a "chosen one" but also will be a "god of wizards". Had that happened, I'd have stopped reading the books just as I stopped reading DN.

That's my stance, and I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. People thinking Light was "brilliant" doesn't tell much about Light's intelligence, but it says a lot about people.

>>84945
That's to display the fact that he hates losing, and is an egotist.

>>84947
They stopped that after a few books. It was only because Ryu is like that. But again, you're strictly ignoring his flaws, and the fact that he's portrayed negatively.

>>84947
But that's the thing. Light wasn't brilliant. He was a very intelligent high school student, but when push came to shove, he did a whole fucking lot of really really stupid shit. He was not brilliant, though he was smart.

He also had a god-complex, was insane, and a mass-murderer. Almost comparable to Azula, if you think about it. Even down to the "constantly adding new powers."
Sure, she kept the consistent "control over fire," but the way she used it changed depending on what she needed.
Too far to jump to a trolley? oh shit look at that shes flying oh my shit.
Regular fire not cutting it? LIGHTNING UP IN THIS BITCH.
She needs to lie about something? Look at that, suddenly she can even fool a living lie-detector.
Her only downsides were that she wasn't very bright(tactical, yes, but ruling by fear is not smart), was insane, and...yeah, that's about it. And pretty much no one considers Azula a Sue.

Holy shit I'm exhausted I bet this is just rambling garbage, but I took the time to type it up, I'm postin' it.

>>84951
That summed it up pretty well actually.

>>84950
>>you're strictly ignoring his flaws, and the fact that he's portrayed negatively.

But I think he's a negative, flawed character, that's why I stopped reading the whole thing. I was under the impression that in the other side, DN fans were the ones ignoring his flaws as they kept preaching of how supposedly smart the whole thing was and how it was some kind of must-read series.

So maybe I was wrong. Or maybe we're both right but just have different ways to express similar ideas.

>>84951
Gladly back to Avatar. Agreed on mostly everything about Azula. But she was an antagonist, they play by different rules. And lightning, we see Azula doing this like the second time she's seen and the first time she's properly introduced iirc. Later we learn both Iroh and Ozai know of this technique too and Zuko gets a good grasp at redirecting it. I think that makes a difference.

Now moving on with the debate, was Toph a Sue yes or no?

>>84953
>But I think he's a negative, flawed character, that's why I stopped reading the whole thing. I was under the impression that in the other side, DN fans were the ones ignoring his flaws as they kept preaching of how supposedly smart the whole thing was and how it was some kind of must-read series.

I guess that makes sense.

>But she was an antagonist, they play by different rules.

So was Light.

>moving on with the debate

FUCK! I already typed all of this and forgot to copy and paste. Whatever I'll post anyway.

>Is toph a sue?

I was about to say yes, but then I thought about it. She had parent issues, but that's too common of a character flaw, so that shouldn't be counted. She's really fucking tough, strong and unbreakable, so I guess that makes her a sue. But wait, the whole tough act was just over compensation for how she was babied throughout her youth, and she still a kid who is afraid of her own mortality and is infact breakable. As shown here.

>>84955
Did anyone really think she was going to die in this scene? I think I've seen a few people say they believed that. And for some reason, Toph was a popular guess when it came to "Which of the main characters might be killed in the finale?" but honestly, I knew that would never happen. When Aang got shot down, that was a surprise, but he was okay in the end. The only main characters I thought might actually die were Ozai and Azula, though I knew Azula was a stretch. It would be easy to kill off the main baddie in a series, but to do it to a 14-year-old girl, no matter how villainous, would be difficult. I'm satisfied with the end results, though I would have liked it if they specified in the show that she was taken to an asylum.

>>84956
No, I knew she waasn't going to die, you're missing my point. SHE thought she was going to die. When the time came, Sokka manned the fuck up and just accepted it and told Toph "This looks like the end.". Toph on the other hand, showed something contradictory to all assumptions of her personality before the finale, real emotion.

>>84957
I wasn't missing your point, that wasn't a response to what you wrote. It just reminded me.