Is an abducted female still a damsel if she's being rescued by a woman?

>>89170
>But if people don't try to push the boundaries of what you can do both design and personality wise

Riiiight, but thats actually the point I'M trying to lead into. Which hightens my confusion over your angst. The corperate mentality and buisness psychology.

Oddly enough, there was a really nice video done on the Escapist that touches on this for MMOs. How bigger producers have better funds, but their corperate psychology prevents them from 'PUSHING THE ENVELOPE':

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/extra-credits/1906-The-Future-of-MMOs

>>89204
>damsel in distress

Thats actually a good question, depending if you're asking literally (because then yes in a gramatical sense), or if you're holding up 'damsel' as a potential archetype.

I'd say that'd depend on the personality and presentation of said 'Damsel', since that'll in turn feed established sterotypes.

>>89204
Well, how many abducted men are around?

Having a pretty female be captured and rendered helpless and tied up is completely okay. That's not a problem. If it is always only a pretty lady, no exceptions, that's a problem.

>>89205
Wow, that really is a considering and thought-provoking video. Imma check out their archives.

On the topic of need for funds = stagnation, that's really why a lot of the newer videogames are all copying the same formula, IMO. Now that graphics have to be so high tech, everything is hella expensive. In the age of 2D pixels you could assemble a team of five dudes to make a game around some crazy concept like an anthropomorphized speedster hedgehog collecting emeralds and if it failed, that was sad but you still had a leg to stand on. Videogames were branching out into new and exciting things because it was low risk to do. Now that it takes a team of 90 and a budget into the millions to make a game, it's a high risk endeavor so no one risks it. And that's why you only really see innovation in the indie games nowadays - for them, it's low risk.

I do wish that the big companies would realize that having the shiniest graphics really isn't everything. Especially nowadays with us starting to reach the graphics plateau, when a game can promise, what, now the fog effects are 2% more believable than the last game OMG!!

Maybe when we finally achieve perfect graphical reality we'll be able to lean back and realize that we don't need perfect graphical reality because we can get that shit in the real world for free.

>>89209

They apparently just started. I've liked what they've done so far.

But this thread and those videos are giving me bad flashbacks to my college days of interning with scriptwriters. Good god.

>>89209
The industry was as derivative back then as it is now, and could be just as risky at times. Don't let the nostalgia goggles ruin your perception of the past, bro

>>89268
Really? I mean, there's always been plagiarism, sure. But a few weeks ago I found my big brothers old gaming mags (you know, those paper things they had before broadband), and there seemed to be much more new ideas, experimenting with genres, and variety. The new IP's were outnumbering the sequels, and there was almost no WWII-shooters. It sure looked like the industry was less derivative.

>>89269
The only real difference between then and now is that:

1) The new IPs get no mainstream attention nowadays, giving devs less incentive to make them.
2) Graphics got worse. Yes, worse.

>>89276
>Graphics got worse. Yes, worse.
Ha ha no.

Unless of course you are referring to the fact that current gen graphics are extremely expensive and time consuming to make, and demanding to run properly.

>>89277
I'd liked to think they were referring to the PS1/N64 era when almost everything looked like it came out of a cow's ass.

>>89278
no, wait, they said "now"....yeah, outside of everything being brown and the same, I don't see it.

>>89279
Yeah, I think that's pretty much excactly what he meant. No when you can just make everything OMG SUPER DETAILED AND REALISTIC few bother with actual good design.

>>89281
I think that's a bit different from straight up "uglier". That said, I do miss having actual colors in my games.

>>89277
This. I think it was Shamus Young that points out, for example, that The Witcher is 8 times as demanding as Oblivion, but they look almost exactly the same. What's the point?

>>89193
It's also entirely possible her creator embellished her own features a bit.

  It's not the brown. Heck, my favorite game of all time is pretty much a brown and bloom extravaganza (Snake Eater).

It's just that graphics are rarely ever polished or thought-out anymore. Games are code set to graphics, but a lot of modern games don't try to hide it. Characters hardly ever show emotion, mooks literally spawn out of nowhere, entire worlds are made up of repeating patterns...

It was much the same in the past, but the devs with money could at least afford to try harder. They hardly ever bother anymore.

As for examples, I'd offer up Fallout 3 as the worst offender, and Guns of the Patriots as the best aversion. Even with it's hurrdurr story, MGS4 was an amazing game for the amount of detail packed into every corner. The way the rebels in South America and the Middle East regard you as a hero if you choose to help them, the drunk wandering the streets in Eastern Europe, the worried rebels discussing their opposition over the severed wing of one of Raven's lackeys, the context sensitive sun in Act 2, the active battles where everyone is busy and has a purpose... It's just wild.

I'm coming off as a huge Metal Gear fanboy in this thread, but I just love how many things this series gets right.

>>89291
>Characters hardly ever show emotion, mooks literally spawn out of nowhere, entire worlds are made up of repeating patterns...
Oh erm gee, that sure didn't happen all the time in the good old days OH WAIT YES IT FUCKING DID.

And Fallout 3 isn't a great example considering that Bethesda has always been sort of shit in the visual department. And most other departments.

>>89301
>>89291
>It was much the same in the past, but

>>89287
It's supposed to be based on her when she was younger. She's portrayed as much older with graying hair by the time Reach fell in the novels....which I think got contradicted by Halo Legends but that whole thing was pretty "eh" all around so...myup.

I remember when Cortana didn't have hair physics...

>>89301
>been sort of shit in the visual department

I think they were refering more to the use of visuals to tell non-plot relevant world stories without words, which Fallout 3 did quite frequently.

>>89203
Goombella is actually a really good example of female-done-right. Not saying that all females should be amorphous heads, but she's chock full of personality that would work well with any plain- or sexual- looking woman.

And then there's this.

>>89464
What is Dead or Alive even ABOUT as a series? I'm told it's a tournament fighter, and that there are actually a lot of male characters, but lord knows I've never seen any evidence of either.

>>89465
The fictional Dead or Alive series depicts several skilled martial artists in a worldwide competition named the "Dead or Alive tournament". DOATEC (Dead or Alive Tournament Executive Committee), a massive corporation with unknown motives, holds the fighting competition in arenas ranging from the North Pole to the Amazon rain forest.

Dead or Alive, the first game in the series, introduces the characters and their reasons for entering the tournament. For example, Zack enters for profit. Kasumi, a runaway kunoichi, enters the tournament to kill her traitorous uncle Raidou. In the end, the strict laws of ninja society prevent Kasumi from returning to her village.

Dead or Alive 2 is set less than a year later. Here, a creature known as the Gohyakumine Bankotsu-bo threatens the world's peace and stability. Kasumi's brother Hayate, previously injured by Raidou, returns from being a subject in DOATEC's bio-weapon experiment Epsilon. New fighters include the opera singer Helena, the mercenary Leon and the kunoichi Ayane. Eventually, Ryu defeats Tengu and thus wins the tournament.

The third game, Dead or Alive 3, takes place shortly after Ryu Hayabusa's defeat of the Gohyakumine Bankotsu-bo. This game's plot concerns DOATEC's secret goal to produce the ultimate fighter, called the Omega project. Through Epsilon and Alpha stages, DOATEC wipes the ninja Genra's memory and turns him into the vicious Omega. A third tournament is held to test Omega's abilities. Ayane, another ninja, destroys the Omega entity. The game introduces three more fighters, Hitomi, Brad Wong, and Christie.

Dead or Alive Xtreme Beach Volleyball is set immediately after the third tournament. The Muay Thai kickboxer Zack uses casino winnings and tournament prize money to buy a private tropical island. He tricks the female competitors onto his island resort for a two week vacation, having led them to believe they were coming to participate in another fight tournament. Though Zack never appears to them in person, they spend their time there competing in beach volleyball tournaments, shopping, and casino games.

Dead or Alive 4 again explores DOATEC's attempts to create the ultimate bio-weapon. The Alpha project created a powerful clone of Kasumi. The various fighters discover the true nature of DOATEC and set out to stop it.

Dead or Alive Xtreme 2 returns to Zack's resurrected private island where he tricks the female fighters into coming around again, and they participate in various water sports, as well as returning to beach volleyball competition and casino games.

>>89466
you will never know any of this in-game, btw. Yeah, Kasumi will be all like "are you my brother?" and shit, but there will be absolutely no context outside of the instruction booklet for ANYTHING.

Except for Zack and Leon. Zack is just an idiot and Leon just wanted to beat the crap out of stuff.

>>89480
Ryu Hayabusa is a cherished video game icon, but aside from that, the characters in DoA are all but devoid of personality.

Zack is your average "cocky black guy" who happens to retain a visual design from when Dennis Rodman jokes were relevant, Ein / Hayate is the blandest possible amnesiac ninja ever to grace a fighting game, Jann Lee is a poor man's Bruce Lee and sadly inferior to fellow expies Marshal Law and Feilong, Bass is (somewhat amusingly) a fat Hulk Hogan, Leon and Bayman are admittedly badass-looking but unmemorable Russian commandos with almost identical movesets, Gen Fu is your generic little old Chinese man, Lei Fang is your generic token Chinese girl, Kasumi is a cookie-cutter ninja with tits, Ayane is an angsty Kasumi with a slightly more inspired visual design and an actual backstory, Helena is a snobby French opera singer with tits (out for REVENGE!), Tina is a blonde American bimbo with huge tits, Hitomi is... Japanese with tits, Christie is a sultry but bland assassin with tits, Brad Wong is a bishonen drunken master, Elliot is Chris from KoF, Spartan is inexplicably Master Chief with tits (in all seriousness), and Lisa is a female Luchador (!) who would probably be much cooler if she hadn't been introduced to the series in the Volleyball titles.

The bosses? 1 had a knockoff Heihachi, 2 had a morbidly obese and unexplained Tengu, 3 had a robot samurai who you fought in a bizarre scrolling match with a forced camera angle, and 4 had an evil Kasumi clone. No joke, they actually just gave Kasumi slightly different moves.

>>89483
you forgot the "and made her cheap as hell" part.

>>89483
>Spartan is inexplicably Master Chief with tits (in all seriousness)

>>89483
That was one of the other Spartans from the books. Her name was Kelly if I remember right. Some kind of... awesome sniper? I dunno, it's been a while since I read them.

>>89488
nope. She was an all new made-up character. She may not even be from the same timeline as I think she's supposed to be from an alternate halo reality or some shit.

>>89488
My knowledge of Halo is entirely second-hand aside of dicking around with my cousin's copy of the first game, but aren't all Spartans supposed to be male?

I like how the SPARTANs are sexy now. In the books they're all disfigured and shit from surgeries and battle.

Also, lol at accentuating breasticles in armor.

  Her breasts don't seem really accentuated, but I guess youtube isn't the best medium for studying spartan boobs.

She is also giant.

>>89491
No, there were females. You didn't need to be male to use the suits, you just needed months to years of enhancement surgery to make your body strong enough to not be crushed.

>>89490
Nevermind, then.

>>89488>>89490

Okay, 1) the spartan from DOA wasn't named Kelly and she wasn't from the books. She was just a new character made for the game.

2) There IS a badass sniper SPARTAN in the books, but her name is Linda and she's awesome. Kelly is also in the books and her big thing is that she is ridicufuckinglously fast. She, too, is awesome.

3) Like Chev said, there were plenty of female Spartans and they didn't have stupid fucking breast-shaped MJOLNIR armor. They looked just the same as the dudes and seriously fuck you Bungie for changing that.

>>89501
wait, they gave lady Spartans boob-armor?

*looks up that Spartan III lady person*

Uh...sorta?

>>89502
Oh, wait, halo legends...yeah, all of that stuff is screwy.

>>89503
That looks... really stupid.

>>89504
it's so stupid.

>>89499
Well Spartans ARE very, very tall.

>>89506
indeed

>>89505
Maybe it's just because all my knowledge of Halo comes from RvB, but if they wanted a female Spartan, they should've just given her black armor and called it a day.

>>89512
>they should've just made her part shark

>>89513
>she should have been from texas

>>89512
>>89513
>>89515

OK OK. We get it. We want a fighting game where we can play a Female Cyborg Half-Shark in Black armour with a cowboy hat. Let's move on!

Lara Croft sold a lot of games in her time.

>>89525
She was also once a good character, before she was hit with the Unstoppable Slut Engine Device (USED).

>>89203

I'd jack it to that.

>>89525
until Core started just phoning it in and started crying about not having enough time to finish Angel of Darkness (how long was the development time on that one?)