What the hell is this shit?

What the fuck were they thinking when they did Blanka's outfit? Or am I missing a reference to something?

>>88008
Sorta?

>>88010
This was the first thing that came to mind when I looked at it.

Found this on /v/, and like it except for the trollish top part.

Face it, Super Smash Brothers deserves the same amount of respect as other fighting games.

>>88070
Yeah, but that's only if you take out everything that makes Brawl what it is. Which basically just leaves you with a dumbed down fighter. It's still a fighting game sure, but there's not going to be vast amount of strategy involved.

>>88073
>Yeah, but that's only if you take out everything that makes Brawl what it is.
What are you saying Brawl is, and what is it you're saying makes it like that?

>Which basically just leaves you with a dumbed down fighter.
Having the majority of special attacks being performable by a single direction and button combination does not make it dumbed down, especially since most fighters don't have a greater variety of attacks, they just require pressing more buttons to perform them.
That's like saying Morse Code is a more eloquent font because it's harder to understand, even though it can't express anything regular letters can't.

>It's still a fighting game sure, but there's not going to be vast amount of strategy involved.
"But"? With the exceptions of a few characters that have unique styles that aren't complete gimmicks (like Testament's traps in Guilty Gear), most fighting games have no strategy but "defend until you get an opening, attack and keep the other guy from attacking back or retreating".

Yes, how to do that is complicated, but it doesn't really involve much forethought, just responding to whatever is happening right now (SSB for the most part included).

>>88070
I would have to agree. I enjoy traditional fighting games, always have and always will, but holy shit does it get old fast.

>>88083
>What are you saying Brawl is, and what is it you're saying makes it like that?

Brawl is more of a party fighting game meant to be enjoyed with all the crazy shit included. Sure, you could play it without all the items and levels, but again you're just taking a majority of the game out just to call it something else.

>Having the majority of special attacks being performable by a single direction and button combination does not make it dumbed down, especially since most fighters don't have a greater variety of attacks, they just require pressing more buttons to perform them.

The controls aren't what make it dumbed down though. It's the lack of abilities. You could give most people a copy of Brawl and they'd probably figure out most characters in a short amount of time. Give the same person something like King of Fighters though and they'll probably have a much harder time getting it.

>"But"? With the exceptions of a few characters that have unique styles that aren't complete gimmicks (like Testament's traps in Guilty Gear), most fighting games have no strategy but "defend until you get an opening, attack and keep the other guy from attacking back or retreating".

>Yes, how to do that is complicated, but it doesn't really involve much forethought, just responding to whatever is happening right now (SSB for the most part included).

But when you've got more options to respond and defend with, do you not think things are going to get more complicated? If I give two people a knife for each of them and told them to fight; they would likely just swing at each other. Sure they're going to have to plan out when to swing at each other at the time, but it isn't going to get much more complicated than that. If I give the same two people an entire army with their own base, then things are going to get a lot more strategic. Sure you could still say that the main tactic is to respond to whatever is happening, but considering there's a lot more things at your disposal the fight is going to get a bit more complicated.

>>88091
...I'm okay with this.

>>88091
S'wait... that means I'm a Baby Bandito Rapper Hipster?

>>88093
Though in honesty, this is more like Tekken Fans.

>>88088
>Brawl is more of a party fighting game meant to be enjoyed with all the crazy shit included. Sure, you could play it without all the items and levels, but again you're just taking a majority of the game out just to call it something else.
Why would having any of that stuff on make it "less" of a fighting game?

>The controls aren't what make it dumbed down though. It's the lack of abilities.
No there aren't. Every characters in SSBB has a neutral ground attack (which changing when done in succession), a dash attack, 3 tilts, 3 smashes, a grab, a pummel attack, 4 throws, 5 aerial attacks, 4 specials, a final smash, a floor recovery, a ledge recovery, a shield, an air dodge, a sidestep, and a roll. Some also have the ability to float, glide (and thus a glide attack), or an aerial grab (Meta-Knight can float and glide).

That's 30-33 abilities in total, including 26 or 27 attacks.

That's not many less than the average fighter. No every single combo possible does not count as a separate ability.

>You could give most people a copy of Brawl and they'd probably figure out most characters in a short amount of time. Give the same person something like King of Fighters though and they'll probably have a much harder time getting it.
And I also just said that those abilities having an input that is more harder to understand (not to master, just to understand) doesn't make the game more complex, it just makes it less accessible.
The phrase "A great game is easy to learn and difficult to master" comes to mind. Just because it's easier to learn how to play SSB at all doesn't mean it's easier to be really good at it.

Having long combinations for abilities isn't very well justified when there aren't close to as many moves as there are input combinations. It's like requiring a five digit code to select from a vending machine that only has 10 available items.

You're also not supporting your last statement at all: you said Smash is dumbed down because it has less moves, but now you're just talking about the moves being easier to learn.

>But when you've got more options to respond and defend with, do you not think things are going to get more complicated?
I just said is was complicated, but it's not strategical. It's not about planning anything in advance or actively making judgements based on the current or future conditions, it's just memorizing the action to take in every situation that will come up.

>>88091
Someone posted that a little while ago.

>>88099
Yeah, it was me. I stole it off of a 1Up blog and just started posting it on 4chan and here after Super Street Fighter 4 came out. It's a surprising source of civil discussion with the occasional whiny Tekken fan. Also, I LOVE the juggling clowns!

>>88073
>Yeah, but that's only if you take out everything that makes Brawl what it is
OK...so, if the game gets rid of its features and everything that makes it its own game, it stops being good?
How exactly is that a valid analysis? That's like saying "If this orange soda didn't taste like orange, it would just be boring old carbonated water". You can't just remove a key part of a thing and then use it as a comparison against itself.

Or are you just talking about the series in general?

>>88099
>Why would having any of that stuff on make it "less" of a fighting game?

Feel free to call me dumb but I'm a bit confused by this statement. If you mean turning items on makes Brawl less of a traditional fighting game; then it would be because it adds randomness to the fight which is what no traditional fighter does.

>That's not many less than the average fighter. No every single combo possible does not count as a separate ability.

Fair enough. I don't have a lot of major experience with SSB aside from what I've played with some friends dicking around and it all felt like a very small move set so I was going by memory.

>And I also just said that those abilities having an input that is more harder to understand (not to master, just to understand) doesn't make the game more complex, it just makes it less accessible.

Less accessible could be because it's more complex though.

>The phrase "A great game is easy to learn and difficult to master" comes to mind. Just because it's easier to learn how to play SSB at all doesn't mean it's easier to be really good at it.

It's not easy to master anything of course, but I'd say it's easier to get the hang of SSB over something like KoF which was my point.

>You're also not supporting your last statement at all: you said Smash is dumbed down because it has less moves, but now you're just talking about the moves being easier to learn.

I was obviously wrong about having less moves. Well, it does. Even you agreed. But not as much as I thought it did. I wouldn't say SSB is dumbed down now after you pointing it out. But I still consider it more of it's own fighting game for how different it is.

>I just said is was complicated, but it's not strategical. It's not about planning anything in advance or actively making judgements based on the current or future conditions, it's just memorizing the action to take in every situation that will come up.

There's always future planning and strategy involved when going up against an opponent. I don't how there can't be. Unless you're just goofing around.

>88102
>OK...so, if the game gets rid of its features and everything that makes it its own game, it stops being good?
>How exactly is that a valid analysis? That's like saying "If this orange soda didn't taste like orange, it would just be boring old carbonated water". You can't just remove a key part of a thing and then use it as a comparison against itself.

Isn't that what SSB fans do though? They take the orange out of orange soda; then say "this is what orange soda should really taste like."

I hate you guys.

>>88070
This is what smashfags actually believe.

It's pointless arguing over whether Brawl is a real fighting game or not.

All that matters is recognizing that all other fighters are inferior to Melty Blood.

>>88102
He's saying that if you limit the stages and remove items, like they do in tournaments, that means your not playing the same game.

>>88109
>If you mean turning items on makes Brawl less of a traditional fighting game; then it would be because it adds randomness to the fight which is what no traditional fighter does.
I think we're vastly misunderstanding each other's points. I'm not arguing that items or unconventional stages don't makes Smash less traditional, I'm saying they don't make it less respectable.
OK, I understand how something as random as items would, but the stages really don't make things as luck based as some people think.

>Less accessible could be because it's more complex though.
Yes, but my point was that the complicated input requirements only made it less accessible.

OK, I guess it depends on how the games effects this:
If the input is requiring you to actually do certain moves to lead up to the special attack the input might be worth it since that actually effects when you can use the attack.
Or the characters really have so many different special attacks that they need multiple input buttons just so doing all of them is possible.
However, if "mastering" the input really just means mashing the series of buttons and directions so fast you might as well have pressed a special "use Attack X" button it's really just arbitrarily making things more difficult.

>Isn't that what SSB fans do though? They take the orange out of orange soda; then say "this is what orange soda should really taste like."
Perhaps the same could be said for all fighting game fandoms.[/Dracula] What with most of the higher level players tending to leave at least half the characters available completely unused in favor of a select few being horribly overused.

I wouldn't say SSB is dumbed down now after you pointing it out. But I still consider it more of it's own fighting game for how different it is.

>I wouldn't say SSB is dumbed down now after you pointing it out. But I still consider it more of it's own fighting game for how different it is.

Which I'm completely happy with. Of course I don't mind anything thinking it's really non-traditional or such--it is; just for starters the primary objective is completely different than most (damage is just a means to an end and ring-outs are what you really go for) and there's far less focus on combos and far more on position/moving around.
What I mind is people acting like having a relatively simple control-scheme means the game is a really shallow button-masher.

>>88116
>OK, I understand how something as random as items would, but the stages really don't make things as luck based as some people think.

I'd agree to a point. Some stages like Yoshi's Island or Pokemon Stadium don't have that much of a luck difference. However stages like Wario Ware Inc. and Rumble Falls can really fuck a person over.

>>88119
>However stages like Wario Ware Inc. and Rumble Falls can really fuck a person over.
...If you suck at the game.

>>88119
Yeah, I guess a lot of WarioWare Inc. could depend on where you are at a random point in time.

And Rumble Falls is horrendously unfair to several of the slower characters (who are low tier enough without that kind of bullshit). That's probably why most stage game mods at least slow the scrolling down.

Whoops.

>Listen to iplaywinner podcast out of curiousity
>learn about how Sega handled VF5
>wat

Fuck man, when was the last time Sega did anything right?

>>88466
Bayonetta?

>>88467
....

point

>>88466

I think Virtua Fighter 5 is pretty fun. It shouldn't ever be a competitive game, but it's fun to pick up and screw around with.

Sonic Unleashed and Shadow the Hedgehog were nowhere near as bad as they've been called. Sonic the Hedgehog isn't as good as SA1 and 2, but it's not THAT AWFUL. And SEGA All-stars Racing is TIGHT.

>>88544
By Sonic the Hedgehog, do you mean the 2006 game? Because no, that really was godawful in every single way. Sonic gets a lot of flack it doesn't deserve, but it's not ENTIRELY without reason.

I do love me Unleashed and All Stars Racing, though. The drifting mechanic is a lot easier to deal with than Mario Kart's for me.

>>88544
I only argue with this post if only because of how much I fucking loved VF4. Those games are fucking hard, but once you find your niche, holy shit, it's ON.

>>88577

Is it just me or is VF5 frighteningly balanced. Jacky and Akira give me trouble (Lau guy here), but more or less losing doesn't feel as frustrating as in Tekken.

>>88587
"frighteningly" is right. They're very very devoted to getting everything right with each installment. Hell, the Sumo dude wasn't in VF5 for the longest time because they weren't sure how to handle his hit-boxes. You know Namco wouldn't have given a shit about stuff like that, at least not to that extent.

Hakan, wat you doing. You stylish motherfucker <3

>>88577

I just meant they simplified the controls to a science, pretty much anyone can pick up the newer Virtua Fighter games and just do whatever. My 5 year old nephew plays the game all the time, and he's you know... 5.

But competitive games should be fun to watch for spectators as well as to play for the players, so juggling... is... yeah.

  We need more special intros in our lives.

SO! your old pal Doctor Hal hasn't played a good fighting game in a while and was thinking of picking up either King of Fighters XIII or Super Street Fighter IV

Now when it comes to the first one I'd pick it up mostly because I've played tons of different Street Fighter games and the VS series and I think it'd be a good change of pace for me, but I'm not sure it's a good jump in point.

Super Street Fighter IV is like putting a different topping on a Nathan's Hot Dog you like the hot dog but you've added something new to change it up a little.

This is all of course to get my hands warmed up for Marvel vs Capcom 3 of course...

>>88622
Do you mean XII? Because you made me get really excited for a second and then very disappointed when I looked it up and found out XIII wasn't out yet.

But yeah, I haven't played XII and general consensus is that this is for the best. Everything I read about it was rage-inducing and I am NOT that hardcore. But yeah, when I heard comparisons to DOA's counter system, I wrote it off. Test versions of XIII seems to be getting lots of love though.

  Can't waaaiiiit

>>88661

Man, Terry is still the homie.

>Get bored
>head to iplaywinner.com cuz why not
>Neo Geo Battle Coliseum has good netcode?!
>My face

>>88745
>realizing that everyone still playing will murder me

http://capcom-unity.com/capcom_games_discussion/go/thread/view/7341/13110251/Help_Ono-san_make_a_new_Darkstalkers_game.&post_num=2521#460405545

Me and my roommate picked up SSF4 a few weeks ago, and I must stay that I haven't this much fun with an online multiplayer game since... probably Diablo 2. It's genuinely satisfying to put time into this game and improve so we can beat better opponents.