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  • 08/21/12 - Poll ended; /cod/ split off as a new board from /pco/.

File 137117950781.jpg - (35.41KB , 208x227 , happyluigi.jpg )
176018 No. 176018
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/13/e3-2013-no-plans-for-smash-bros-dlc-tripping-removed
>Sakurai also confirmed to me that tripping, a significant and frustrating element from Super Smash Bros. Brawl had been removed.
>tripping had been removed
This is the best news of all of E3. All Years.
Expand all images
>> No. 176019
Oh yeah, last thread: >>173583

>>176017
I completely forgot about her, and she would absolutely work; cooking opens itself to a lot of potential attacks. (Sanji from One Piece, minus the martial arts.) I'd also like to see Jimmy from Wario Inc., and have Wario focus on his platforming moves.
>> No. 176021
File 137118007357.jpg - (231.49KB , 1013x936 , gaben-wat.jpg )
176021
And then there's this:
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/13/e3-2013-smash-bros-wii-u-3ds-final-names-revealed
>E3 2013: Smash Bros. Wii U, 3DS Final Names Revealed
>In this case, series creator Masahiro Sakurai is thinking in simpler terms - the two games are called Super Smash Bros. for 3DS and Super Smash Bros. for Wii U.
I seriously hope these are Japanese names only, because that's some absolute bullshit. One of Nintendo's biggest franchises and they can't bother to think of a good subtitle? Even a fucking "4" would have been better.

>mfw we will never see a Super Smash Brothers Kerfuffle
>> No. 176022
>>176021
They're just doing like Apple did with the iPad. Not much point in the numbers if there's only one version of the game on each system.

It's pretty much the same thing as calling them "Super Smash Bros. U" and "Super Smash Bros. 3D"
>> No. 176023
>>176019
Yeah, I hadn't thought of it, but Cooking Mama's sort of a perfect suggestion in a way a lot of the 3rd Party suggestions I see aren't. Like I see people suggesting the Prince from Katamari Damacy or other off the wall choices and it's like--man, I love Katamari, but it has NOTHING to do with Nintendo. Cooking Mama, on the other hand, was one of the first big hits on DS when the DS's library was still pretty lacking in any big draws, and as far as I'm aware, every single entry in the series has been on Nintendo. Which isn't even true of Megaman, though at least he was a huge franchise on both NES and Super Nintendo.
>> No. 176025
File 137118537651.jpg - (76.15KB , 800x450 , sagi_and_kalas___baten_kaitos_by_phoenicanwaters-d.jpg )
176025
Monolith Soft characters are fair game right? It would be neat if one of the Baten Kaitos, Sin and Punishment, or Golden Sun characters joined for real. There's tons of move potential for the last one.
>> No. 176026
>>176025
They are a first party developer; the question is if Namco (the prior owners) retained any rights to properties they did before that happened.

They also did Xenoblade, and I would absolutely love to see some Xenoblade characters in there (likely just Shulk, the Monado would allow him a unique style). Golden Sun would also work well, having a very unique fighting style; whoever is included could have four Djinn following him or her; neutral A uses one of them to attack, and after that the Djinn rests briefly, which changes the other moves available to the fighter. Plenty of potential for the Smash attack, too.
>> No. 176027
>the question is if Namco (the prior owners) retained any rights to properties they did before that happened.
Speaking of, if Namco hasn't held the rights to Xenosaga I wonder if we can get a Xenosaga HD for the Wii U...
>> No. 176040
File 137121435820.jpg - (12.63KB , 285x534 , 1371063061729.jpg )
176040
>> No. 176043
"the cast won’t have a significant third-party presence and that the Blue Bomber should be seen as a special case."
From an interview.

Also WiiU and 3DS won't have crossplay.
>> No. 176045
>>176043
Aww, but Sanic was one of my mains...
>> No. 176048
>>176045
Well Sonic might be considered a Nintendo first party character nowadays.

>tfw no Sanic Generations rerelease for WiiU
>> No. 176052
>>176043
They'e been saying this since Brawl came out, I don't know why people are suddenly surprised.
>> No. 176057
>>176043
They just mean don't expect more than a handful of 3rd-party characters since it's still primarily a Nintendo fighter after all. It's the same thing they said about Brawl which only had two of them.
>> No. 176059
>>176057
This.
At most we'll get 5 I'd say. This isn't Sony Smash.

Also really debating on finally getting a 3DS for the new Pokemon and Brawl... What are the odds they'll unveil a new version with a second analog stick anytime soon?
>> No. 176072
>>176017
I'm totally OK with this. I was going to put up Okamiden, but then I remembered it'd be a guest character, so Mama ends up winning since most of the new characters in Command aren't that good.

It'll be interesting to see how many version exclusives there are.
>> No. 176092
I want Professor Layton in this game.
>> No. 176093
>>176072
I forget, is Cooking Mama first party or third party? I agree that she would be a fun and cute addition, considering much weirder characters have gotten in in the past.
>> No. 176096
>>176093
I thought it was first party, but a quick Wiki check says that it's third, so she's probably out. :( Not even a Nintendo exclusive, there have been iOS Cooking Mama games apparently.
>> No. 176097
http://techland.time.com/2013/06/14/even-nintendo-is-stumped-by-the-wii-u-gamepad/

Basically my problem with the Wii U. There doesn't seem to be any games on the horizon that puts the Wii U Gamepad to good use.
>> No. 176102
>>176097

I get the feeling Nintendo thought they could treat a touchscreen in your hands like you could treat the DS's touch screen, without realizing that there's a big difference between holding a gaming console in your hands and viewing both screens, and holding a controller in your hands you have to look down at and view and then look up at a TV.

Imagine if a game had a quick-time event, but instead of it being a button you've mentally trained yourself to know the position of and just click it, you had to actually look down, see where the button was on your controller and tap it. It'd just be, for lack of a better term, jarring.

Oh god Bayonetta 2. Please don't use the WiiU's touchpad for anything. Please.
>> No. 176105
>>176102
>without realizing that there's a big difference between holding a gaming console in your hands and viewing both screens, and holding a controller in your hands you have to look down at and view and then look up at a TV.
That's a good point. They also made the GamePad such that you were in an either-or situation for the most part; either you can use the regular controls, or you can use the touchscreen, but not both, during fast-paced gaming. (When using regular controls, I think you have a small arc with your thumb over the screen, but nothing really useful.) A smaller screen, say 3DS size, would have worked much better (and it would have made it cheaper, as they could have used the same screens for both the Gamepad and the 3DS). Maybe have it not even be a touch screen, but instead have a touchpad that runs along the back (like the vita) or around the sticks. I'm still mad that they didn't re-employ the Gamecube button layout, which I feel is superior to any other.

This does kill the "play on the Gamepad" thing, but there are two problems with that:
1) At least in America, this was never a good selling point
2) Games that support this can't make good use of the Gamepad's features in the first place

>Oh god Bayonetta 2. Please don't use the WiiU's touchpad for anything. Please.
According to reports from E3, the game gives you the choice of using the Touchpad, where you can play in "Easy" or "Very Easy" mode and is essentially Tap to Win, or using standard controls with the more complex options open to you.
>> No. 176162
>Start looking at 3DS prices
>Still around $150-$200
Thought for sure they'd be around $100 used by now.
>> No. 176163
Nintendo doing DLC? Fuck you gaming. Crash already! Anyone else just HATE DLC on principle of what it is?
>> No. 176165
>>176163
I used to hate DLC until I played Deus Ex: HR - The Missing Link. DLC can be fantastic, if a lot of thought and work is put into it. Sadly, it almost never is.
>> No. 176167
>>176163

I think it depends on the mindset behind the DLC. Some publishers mandate that DLC to strip the game of parts B and C for later sell or just outright say "Make this and then keep it for later" while Others if Nintendo continues their current thinking will be more of the groups that go "Hey I think I can add more fun things to this game" Like with the Super Luigi DLC they are doing.


>>176165
Really hoping all platforms get the directors cut upgrade. I really want a boss battle that doesn't turn into an arena fight.
>> No. 176169
>>176163
I like the idea of DLC as extended a game after it's released using new ideas or stuff that wasn't able to be included during development for one reason or another (usually an idea late in dev and not having enough time.) Paying smaller amounts for more story or characters is great. Like the whole Super Luigi U, that's good DLC.

What I don't like is DLC planned from the get go, where content could have been on the disc but instead is "Day One DLC". Or, worse, where the data is on the disc but you have to pay to unlock it. That's bullshit.

(Of course, the flip side is that I pay for Season Pass and get anxious when I hear nothing within a month or three after the game comes out, like Bioshock Infinite.)

It should be noted that "episodic gaming" was the idea before "DLC". Valve failed horribly at this; only Tell Tale Games has really been able to properly implement the idea.
>> No. 176177
>>176169
I think Fire Emblem Awakening did a pretty good job with the DLC. Most of it was free for a period of time anyway, and the units you could get weren't even necessary for the full gaming experience. The three paid bounty DLCs just made it easier to grind for gold, experience, and weapons, but you could still play the same way without them.
>> No. 176178
>>176023
And the Gameboy.
>> No. 176187
I wonder if we will ever get another advance wars.
>> No. 176188
>>176187
Intelligent Systems might get the chance since the recent Fire Emblem did so well.
>> No. 176189
Went to local best buy to demo E3 games. It was too busy, so I only got to play Donkey Kong Country, but oh man, Wind Waker HD looks so good.
>> No. 176231
>>176188
I wouldn't mind that. Bring back the Black Hole army setting. That reboot was ok but the cartoony look was fun.
>> No. 176282
File 137147550582.png - (310.33KB , 742x863 , 1371475125301.png )
176282
Thanks /v/
>> No. 176284
>>176282
Delaying games is bad. And also wrong. Badwrong. I will stand for the opposite of badwrong...gnodwdab.
>> No. 176338
File 137152762311.jpg - (42.00KB , 423x270 , tvix.jpg )
176338
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=594186
So, Japan and Europe got this...
>> No. 176340
So what are some thoughts on the gold and platinum awards for this year. Some think one could be that Luigi hat sported in the Year of Luigi announcement could be the platinum.
>> No. 176347
File 13715680824.jpg - (167.56KB , 839x583 , Jet_Set_Radio_full_639081.jpg )
176347
Okay, so... Jet Set Radio, on the Wii U, you can make customize sprays with the gamepad.

How do we get Nintendo and Sega to make this?
>> No. 176349
>>176347
Convince them a cult game with a niche audience is somehow profitable.
>> No. 176357
Super Smash Bros. creator Masahiro Sakurai recently told IGN that although Namco Bandai is working on both Smash titles, their characters will not be receiving any special consideration for being added to the roster.
>Just because the game is being cooperatively developed with Namco Bandai involved, that doesn’t at all mean that they’d be given any special consideration for having characters in the game. Smash Bros. can still be considered as an all-star collection of Nintendo characters. Just like with Mega Man or any other third-party character, it would have to be a very special situation.


Sakurai went on to explain that acquiring third-party characters as playable in Super Smash Bros. is a very grueling process. Even when adding those from the Pokemon franchise, it turned out to be much tougher than many can imagine.

>Adding third-party characters should be considered a very special case. In the last game, when we added Sonic and Snake, there were lots of different hoops to jump through as far as getting approvals and making sure all the parties involved were happy with the way things went. You can consider it a very special circumstance for that to happen.

>Even in cases like adding Pokemon characters, there are a lot of parties involved and there’s a lot of wrangling. It’s much tougher than people can imagine. I know lots of people have requests and their own ideas about third-party characters that would work, but I want people to understand that adding a third-party character like Mega Man is a very special situation.
>> No. 176366
>>176357
The thing is, I don't think many people realize just which IPs are Nintendo's and which are third party. Like the Pokemon thing, for example.
>> No. 176370
>>176366
What would Game Freak be considered? Second party? While they haven't always, they now develop exclusively for Nintendo (and are likely paid a tidy sum to continue doing so), but Nintendo doesn't own a controlling share like they had in Rare or are outright owned like Retro Studios is. Exclusive third party? 2.5 party?

And yeah, it never occurred to me that they'd have to jump through extra hoops to get Pokémon in Smash.
>> No. 176378
>>176366
Yeah, most of the time I hear of Pokemon as being a second party franchise. I was always under the assumption it was the same situation as Rare though, and Nintendo owned some stock of it.
>> No. 176380
>Game Freak and Pokemon are not owned by Nintendo
My mind is seriously fucking blown...
>> No. 176386
They're a partnership.
>> No. 176388
>>176386
That's what they call "second party" games right?
>> No. 176414
>>176388
Anyone that does doesn't understand what "third party" means.

Second Party is the consumer. First Party is the manufacturer of the hardware. Because these terms are references to the transaction of buying the initial system. Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo make a thing as the First Party, they sell it to you, the Second Party, and you proceed to purchase software and additional hardware made by Third Parties that are not owned by the manufacturer of the system, and are not you.
>> No. 176419
>>176414
>Because these terms are references to the transaction of buying the initial system.
We're talking about how the developer relates to the console manufacturer; the consumer doesn't come into this description at all.

Wiki sez: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_developer
>a first-party developer is part of a company which manufactures a video game console and develops exclusively for it. First-party developers may use the name of the company itself (such as Nintendo), have a specific division name (such as Sony's Polyphony Digital) or have been an independent studio before being acquired by the console manufacturer (such as Rare or Naughty Dog).
>Second party developer is a colloquial term used by gaming enthusiasts and media often used to describe two different types of game development studios: 1) Independently-owned studios who take development contracts from the platform holders and what they produce will usually be exclusive to that platform. 2) Studios who are partially or wholly owned by the platform holder (also known as a subsidiary) and what they produce will usually be exclusive to that platform.
>Third-party developers are usually called upon by a video game publisher to develop a title for one (or more) systems. Both publisher and developer have considerable input in the game's design and content. However, the publisher's wishes generally override those of the developer.
>Independents are small software developers which are not owned by (or dependent on) a single publisher. Some of these developers self-publish their games, relying on the Internet and word of mouth for publicity.

So, by those descriptions, Game Freak is a Second Party developer.
>> No. 176498
>>176388
The ones no one ever talk about.
Also http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/2013/06/satoru-iwata-we-are-to-blame/
The first is the hardest, props.
>>176338
But I dont wanna pay extra...
Even if squad and mansion looks so sweet...
>> No. 176499
>>176498
While they've certainly been lackluster in their marketing of the Wii U, the entire console was flawed from the get go, so just improving marketing to a point equitable to "Wii would like to play" won't do much.
>> No. 176511
File 137167785895.png - (443.59KB , 634x350 , plebeian levels at 109 percent.png )
176511
>Nintendo is the only console manufacturer that still region-locks games.
>> No. 176520
File 137167991853.jpg - (153.21KB , 410x426 , tumblr_mas4yk0isZ1qg03pro2_500.jpg )
176520
>>176511
>> No. 176521
>>176511
Yeah, that's pretty funny that the XBox 180 is now region unlocked, too. In one short post, Nintendo's offerings suddenly look a lot less worthwhile.
>> No. 176531
>>176521
>In one short post, Nintendo's offerings suddenly look a lot less worthwhile.

>Still $500 with mandatory Kinect

Yeah, no.
>> No. 176532
>>176521

Eh, you still have free online play and Exclusives to hang your hat on.
>> No. 176537
>>176531
Thing is, most gamers don't seem to give a shit about being spied on, so having the Kinect required isn't a deal-breaker for them. Having the check-in and game lock was, hence >>176510.

I suppose that if you're strapped for cash and can't spend $500, you could spend $250 for a Wii U. However, right now the XBox One has a lot more interesting games on the horizon to "core" gamers than the Wii U does. Plus, with the launch of the Xbone and PS4, graphics will take another (but less perceptible) leap, again leaving Nintendo behind and causing a lot of multiplats to skip them entirely. (Or, if the trend holds, a Wii U exclusive will become multi-plat after a year or so, sometimes with even better graphics and more options.)

>>176532
But there are still no gaems, and even by the time the Xbone launches there will only be a few gaems.
>> No. 176539
File 137168891294.gif - (100.75KB , 400x277 , Eye_roll_John.gif )
176539
>>176537
>However, right now the XBox One has a lot more interesting games on the horizon to "core" gamers

Ah yes, how could I forget the ever-present allure of the shoot-gun gaems.
>> No. 176540
http://www.polygon.com/2013/6/17/4438642/super-smash-bros-director-masahiro-sakurai-character-selection

I admire his dedication to the craft, but he REALLY needs to take a long vacation after this. Also notable: Nintendo approached Capcom about adding Mega Man to the roster, not the other way around.
>> No. 176542
>>176539
Don't forget Dead Rising 3: We Sucked All the Fun Out But Now You Can Call Down an Air Strike With Your Phone and Ryse: QTE of Rome.
>> No. 176545
>>176537
>fine with Microsoft spying on you at all times
>> No. 176546
>>176539
I don't want to see the Wii U overwhelmed with crouch-n-shoots like the 360 is and Xbone inevitably will be, but I would like to have some games like that. Variety is the spice of life; it would be great to play Zelda one day and Borderlands or Rage the next.

Right now all it has or has announced is the Cowadooty/Battlefield games that are coming to freaking everything anyway. And ZombiU, if you like (which had an interesting setup, but like all Ubisoft games lacked polish and got middling scores.) Action/Adventure is only slightly better.
>> No. 176552
>>176540
I think Nintendo approaching is the "normal" process for a 3rd party character. I remember back when Brawl was in development Inafune stated he wanted Mega Man in, and was disappointed that Nintendo never contacted them.
>> No. 176591
http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2013/jun/19/sakurai-explains-how-pokemon-characters-are-chosen-super-smash-bros-not-enough-time-bring-back-entire-smash-
roster-wii-3ds/
>> No. 176595
>>176552
I'm not going to type my 2 cents on Inafune; but sitting by the phone hoping someone will call you and ask you to the dance is the chumps way and only buys you sympathy points that only people that do the same thing care about.

>>176546
Nintendo really lacked good third party support since the Wii days and now they're caught in a run down. They need more 3rd party devs to sell consoles, but they need to sell more consoles to look more appealing to 3rd party devs. It's the old WoW paradox.
>> No. 176596
>>176540
>"Whether it's a minor character or a character that is one of the most highly skilled and most played," Sakurai said, "if that character is removed from the game, the people who live for that character in Smash Bros. are going to have their feelings hurt.

I know that feel; I maned Mewtwo in Melee and Lucario, Falco, and Snake in Brawl. It would not surprise me if none of those characters return. And while it would really suck (especially Snake for his unique playstyle) I'll just have to learn to move on and adapt as usual.

>>176591
... This has me thinking that we might see "Mewthree" or (less likely) Genisect in Kerfuffle with how much focus they seem to be getting from the anime and movies now. And I'm totally ok with that. Unfortunately I would probably say Zoroack (or however it's spelled) would be the most likely since it was the signature Pokemon of Black/White, but I don't think the Pokemons signature mimic/transforming illusion ability would be a good fit since we already have Kirby.
>> No. 176600
Nintendo at E3: Abridged Versionyoutube thumb
>> No. 176605
>>176596
Gen VI will be out long before Brawl is anyway, so I don't think being the underwhelming mascot of Gen V would do it for Zoroark.
>> No. 176607
File 137174532740.jpg - (180.66KB , 700x1506 , 1292298096939.jpg )
176607
>>176605
They made the mistake of making getting him be event only.
I mean, it ties in with the movie, but still.
Changing that up in B2W2 may have been too little too late.
>> No. 176609
http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2013/jun/20/mewtwo-might-return-new-super-smash-bros/
>> No. 176612
>>176607
That's another long-standing problem I've had with Pokemon: Event-only creatures. It's not so bad now because you can get some from the Dream Zone, and I have a car so I can drive to Gamestop/Toys R Us, but when they do releases for, say, BW2 but not BW, or if they only ever offer one Pokemon one time and you would have to fly across the country for, etc.

It's worse than DLC, because at least with DLC I can pay $X and get the thing immediately instead of having to hunt it down.
>> No. 176614
>>176612

>boo challenge just let me pay money for content!

I guess you just don't wanna be a master.

But seriously, I think that's part of the point. These aren't things you can just buy directly from Nintendo for so many dollars. They're notoriously difficult to get (for awhile anyways). It drives completionists crazy but at the same time it's makes actually catching them all that much more satisfying. The harder the challenge, the more sweet the reward, as it were.
>> No. 176617
>>176614
This isn't about challenge. This is about the possibility of having to fly across the country to freaking New York if I want to legitimately "own" a certain Pokemon otherwise unobtainable within the game.

Going to GameStop and Toys R Us isn't a problem now, though it was when I was younger and lived an hour from either place. If every event Pokemon was released through those venues (or, even better, the Dream World), I'd be okay with the special events.

I definitely don't want them to charge money for just downloading a Pokemon, but I hate that idea less than being completely unable to get them at all. For a series with heavy emphasis on capturing all of them, this is unacceptable to me.
>> No. 176619
>>176617
Going to those stores IS a problem if you don't live in the US. Most countries in Europe or anywhere else never get events like these in local stores.
>> No. 176620
>>176614
I can't believe it. An opinion dumber than "grinding takes skill".

Congratulations, that was the worst non-troll/political Pokemon-related post I've read in a while.

Challenge in a videogame should always be about MASTERING ITS MECHANICS, not things OUTSIDE OF THE GAME.
>> No. 176621
>>176620
On one hand I think receiving Mew from Nintendo back in the old days was pretty damn cool and special.
On the other hand I really don't care for the "timed exclusive" Pokemon they release or the now large roster of event/ timed location specific Pokemon.

For that reason I'm extremely glad there have been programmers who have managed to "crack the code" to make getting these things non-painful. Same for egg moves because holy shit is that irritating; just like grinding for IVs and EVs which sucks the fun right out of the games in my opinion.
Mostly because if you're not spending hours and hours grinding invisible numbers and breeding for the specific moves, stats, and natures while using some of the most powerful Pokemon to start with, your asshole is going to be torn asunder should you decide to have a fight online with anyone.

In short I'm just crabby because I miss the days when you could throw in a link cable and have a nice casual battle with someone and then slap their shit if they have a Magikarp that can use Hyper Beam every turn.
>> No. 176623
Mew was cool because there was NO official way to get it. It was a true secret Pokemon, one which you could only obtain through illicit backyard deals or glitches. Hell, they didn't even acknowledge its existence until after the fact. Event Pokemon aren't anywhere near the same, they're just regular Legendaries that have an absurd requirement to obtain. Online events aren't SO bad (although they shouldn't have deadlines) but making it so the only people who can get Meloetta or Genesect are people who can come to a handful of stores is annoying as hell with no real benefit. It's tradition that's warped, and it should go away especially with online events having become a much more practical alternative.
>> No. 176624
>>176623
>with no real benefit.

Well, the benefit is for the store, I think. I'm pretty sure that's the whole point of "Special Edition" pokemon, a marketing ploy to get feet in the door by partnering with certain businesses.
>> No. 176643
>2013 is Starfox's 20th Anniversary
>2011 Nintendo busy jerking off Zelda series for it's 25 year Anniversary
>Fans bawwing that Metroid is being ignored
>Practically give away Super Metroid this year; better late than never
StarFox is suffering
>> No. 176645
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/20/dont-get-your-hopes-up-for-f-zero
>> No. 176646
>>176645
Meh this is why I don't care much for Nintendo anymore. When they do this or just make shallow Mario games (get to 8 worlds and a Special world) like "new" Super Mario Bros or 3D Land/World I just get disinterested.

And Zelda? Oh man is that series due for a massive revamp. SS was just unimpressive. I see more originality in Metal Gear Solid 5 or Peace Walker's gameplay than what I saw in SS.

And the kicker is too many of Nintendo's games feel "samey" like you play one and you played them all.
>> No. 176650
>>176646
I feel that SS was the height and culmination of all 3D Zelda gameplay. You weren't going to find any radical departure in it, but you would find all the best stuff from Zelda there in great form. (Except Fi, who was worse than Navi. At least her dancing was something above what Navi offered.)

But I agree that it would be great to see a departure from the standard Zelda game in the main line, perhaps deviating from the idea of two worlds (which has been an almost-constant thing since OoT). I'd love to see a plot and side quest setup on the scale of Xenoblade Chronicles used in the Zelda universe.

As for Mario, I think Nintendo pumps them out because he's easy, especially since they apparently don't care about 3D epics like Galaxy. Create 8 worlds, 6-10 levels per world, use the same overall world design, the same old power-ups (introducing one or two new-but-related-to-old ones to be "fresh"), Bowser's kids as bosses, and have someone who got captured by Bowser as your only plot point. None of the games are bad, per se, but they've followed the same model since NSMB on the DS, so they're fairly stale (a reason the multiplayer aspect is so hyped in them now, as that makes them something adults can play with their kids.)

This blends back into my beef with Pokemon, as every game has been "kid leaves for adventure against 8 gyms which must be done in a particular order (with a bit of leeway now and then) and the E4, Team X is causing problems and he also needs to stop them, all with new Pokemon. Oh, and we have some silly dance/pageant/sports that is never reused." BW changed it a bit by making the Big Bad appear at the end of the E4, which is a nice change, but otherwise was the same.

Anyway, it also helps that he's their most visible and well-known character, not to mention company mascot.
>> No. 176652
>>176650
>I feel that SS was the height and culmination of all 3D Zelda gameplay.
Words do not exist to respond to this

>But I agree that it would be great to see a departure from the standard Zelda game in the main line, perhaps deviating from the idea of two worlds (which has been an almost-constant thing since OoT). I'd love to see a plot and side quest setup on the scale of Xenoblade Chronicles used in the Zelda universe.
Xenoblade sidequests mostly are just MMO garbage though, collect 12 bear asses and all that. The one good thing about them is that they usually gave them to you in a big chunk when you entered an area and you didn't have to actually turn most of them in. Zelda sidequests are already mostly collection related, but they tend to be a few large collections as opposed to a flood of small ones, which wouldn't be an improvement.

Unless you're referring to the Colony 6 stuff, which also all just scavenger hunt bullshit but with the mildly interesting reward of rebuilding a town. Zelda has done this sort of thing too, but usually in the form of "just collect rupees and pay one person" which is far less frustrating than what Xenoblade did.
>> No. 176653
>>176652
Yeah, Xeno had a lot of the standard collection fare, though it did it far better than most games, both by giving you most basic quests when you first enter an area (as you said), and, in most cases, also giving you the reward as soon as you finished the quest, instead of having to backtrack to talk to someone.

However, they had other quests which focused on character interaction; sometimes it was as simple as just "listening" to some character's spiel, other times you were involved in making big choices. In addition, some fetch quests had "alternate" ends that would allow you to complete the quest, but not necessarily in the manner specified in the beginning (such as giving a particular item to a different character.) One such set was actually set up that you could only "complete" one, as finishing one would make you fail the other. These gave much-needed variety both within the game and within the genre in general. I'd love to see that applied more in Zelda. (They don't need the generic fetch quests, though.)

>Words do not exist to respond to this
Try.
>> No. 176654
>>176652
>Words do not exist to respond to this
Please don't be that guy.
>> No. 176655
>>176653
I guess there were times when you got rewarded just for hearing the story but i don't remember the rest of that. I guess by the time the interesting stuff would have been opening up that game was already wearing out its welcome.

God Xenoblade was disappointing.

>>176653
>Try.
SS was devolution in action. Smaller world, crummy dungeons, etc etc. But most of my issues with that game don't directly relate to the sidequest issue so it doesn't really matter.
>> No. 176656
I do agree that the next big Zelda needs better sidequests, I just don't know if Xenoblade would really be the example I'd pick for sidequesting done right.
>> No. 176659
>>176656
Better sidequests and frankly higher difficulty. Make Full Revival Faeries rare (and only be able to hold ONE). Make it so Link can carry one potion type and no extras. Make enemies hit harder and extremely rarely drop hearts and rupees so that shops and treasure chests with rupees actually have a use.
>> No. 176661
>>176655
>God Xenoblade was disappointing.
We're two people of very different minds, then; Xenoblade is my favorite game.

>Smaller world, crummy dungeons, etc etc.
I felt it was large enough, but perhaps I was skewed by all the backtracking. Discussion on the worth of dungeons in just one Zelda game would make a thread all its own, so I'll just leave that comment alone.
>> No. 176663
>>176661
Xenoblade was good until certain characters went total JRPG protagonists. Hopefully that won't happen in the sequel or whatever the next Xenogame is, but there were some parts that became terrible over time.
>> No. 176664
I think the big problem with Zelda sidequests is that rewards are tough to implement given the way Zelda works. In a full-on RPG, there are all sorts of cool powers or items that can be given to the hero for accomplishing a sidequest, but Zelda has a much smaller number of items, and most sidequests end up going with Heart Containers (which are near useless as rewards for skill/tenacity given how easy most Zeldas are these days and that people who finish sidequests tend to be the type who are good enough players not to need them) or Rupees (which, again, fall prey to being useless late game).

Skyward Sword made some inroads there with all the tool upgrade options and potions with weird effects (not to mention item durability making rupees more useful). I think in the future they need to expand on that concept, and doing so will make it possible to have more relevant sidequests with more palpable rewards. Once there's cool stuff to reward the player with, sidequests will flow naturally as means of giving them to players.
>> No. 176665
>>176664
I liked the environmental sidequests of the old 2D zeldas. Where you could just go and find the secret puzzles, dungeons and ~optional gear~. No/minimal NPC setups and trade crap.
>> No. 176672
>>176664
See I loved the idea of the RPG style upgrade system, but it was based primarily on randomized loot drops, which while far more merciful than some other games (again, Xenoblade) is still an excellent way to make me go crazy. And the idea of having a whole bunch of different potions with different buff effects was interesting but crippled by the fact the game is, as you said, far too easy.

Useful rewards are an issue, but I think ultimately they're less of an issue than the questing itself. Ideally a sidequest is its own reward, fun to do in and of itself whether you get anything out of it or not.
>> No. 176703
File 137182117924.jpg - (112.73KB , 650x406 , 650x.jpg )
176703
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/06/exclusive_conkers_bad_fur_day_creator_chris_seavor_is_bringing_rusty_pup_to_wii_u
>> No. 176707
>>176643
Zelda sells well everywhere and adds a new gimmick or two every iteration so people will keep reeating the same hash (it's Nintendos COD); Metroid sells like shit outside of the US apparently, but at least it tries to do some new things every iteration; And StarFox... has it EVER really sold well or even tried to innovate?
>> No. 176712
http://www.mariomarathon.com/

These guys are raising money for Child's Play by marathoning a bunch of Mario games. If they hit $82k, they'll 100% every Mario game on their list.
>> No. 176772
File 137192063341.png - (714.30KB , 1024x600 , Screenshot_2013-06-22-11-55-52.png )
176772
Reggie: The big innovation in this game is that there is a cat suit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7hzVAMMw0I&feature=youtube_gdata_player
>> No. 176773
>>176707
Assault and Command did more with the property than 64, but I think the shadow of Adventures loomed so large that many people just ignored them.
>> No. 176777
>>176772
...fair enough.
The biggest change to Galaxy 2 was a Yoshi and that turned out to be a blast.
>> No. 176780
>>176773
Command took Starfox in a pretty new and interesting direction. Unfortunately the characters it introduced did not and the lack of multiplayer, an "arcade mode", or a mission editor where a big let down. While sharing fuel between all ships made the game a little more difficult or was ultimately pretty dumb.
>> No. 176782
>>176780

There was multiplayer. It wasn't good, but it was there.
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