>>218759
We're too busy talking about NOT MUH Sally and the Nu252

Sonic>All

>>218767

I'm sure if Mega Man's retail release schedule wasn't so fucked we'd at least have a couple people pretending to have a conversation about it.

>>218768
>Pretending

Fuck you. Curse of Ra Moon is being awesome.

http://www.destructoid.com/have-some-sample-pages-for-mega-man-31-264917.phtml

>>218780
>The Nerbs were made by Angelo deCesare, the same guy who made Larry and the Arctic FFs. He also still works at Archie, so if anyone's likely to be safe, it's characters he made.

Not necessarily. They got burned bad by using Ken's chars when they couldn't find the original copy of his contract. From here on out it comes down to them being able to either find the original contract of a creator or, presumably, convince the creator to sign something new. Of course it would be a bit awkward to go up to someone like deCesare and go "So... we've been using your creations on occasion and it turns out, funny story, we don't have the paperwork legally letting us do that. Would you mind signing something to give up the right to sue us?"

There might be some creators where they have a good enough relationship they feel comfortable more-or-less doing that, but for the most part I think from here on out it comes down to whether or not they can find the original contracts or not.

>>218787
I said likely, not definitely. I mean that out of everyone who isn't Ian or Sega-official, Angelo's stuff has the best chance of being safe.

Also worth noting they're still using Tania Del Rio's Nicole design as a base for her current look, so it's not like Archie's so worried that they're running from everything that could be a potential problem.

>>218787
I think the logic in that statement was "they're the most likely to be safe because DeCesare still works at Archie and he's probably the easiest old writer to go back to and say "Can we talk about this stuff?"

Same reason they probably didn't drastically redesign Nicole.

>>218788
>>218789
...How did we manage to post the same things like that? Get out of my head, man.

>>218791
Because it's a really easy conclusion to come to?

If Tania Del Rio is relatively a new person, she's probably under the same kind of contract Ian and Tracy are.

It's also reasonable to assume that after the Penders thing Archie would have had all their current employees and work-for-hires sign an updated contract if they wanted to keep working for them.

>>218798
Well, I'd assume they did that only for those they couldn't find active contracts for; everyone else probably maintained the status quo. Ian and Tracey are recent enough that they probably have good copies and strong contracts somewhere, and anyone else working for Archie that needed it probably just signed something codifying their duties and who gets the copyright on their characters created for Archie series (hint: it's Archie.) If someone were good about it they might have been able to renegotiate their salary while they were dealing with this crap anyway.

Any contracts they had, that were proper about assigning rights, probably got copied and re-signed in quadruple, with one copy being sent into orbit and another to Siberia so they can make sure to have backups.

>>218800
>Salary
>Working at Archie

hahahahahahaha
That's not how that works, bud. I get what you're saying, but holy crap that's rich.

>>218809
Is it commission per issue or something, then?

>>218823
Yup. I'm REALLY fortunate Archie wants to throw me three books consistently.

Damn, after all this they're STILL clinging to work-for-hire? Sigh.

Of course, that's starting to creep back over at Marvel and DC too. Alan Moore was right, making movies out of comics made WB/Disney decide to shift back to shittier contracts, since they don't want to have to pay creators when their creations appear in movies.

Still, at least with the big two you can hope to get something for your reprint work. And I know that a few years ago one of the more standard contracts (according to Mark Waid at least) stated that creators would see a little Cha-Ching if their characters later got toys/multimedia, and a very small something if the characters appeared in something that sold unusually well. Every once in a while Waid got a pleasant surprise in the form of a check saying "Impulse turned out to be popular again, here's your cut".

Hey, maybe, just maybe now that Waid is working for Archie he can convince them to adopt better contracts!

Yeah, and maybe I'm a Chinese jet pilot.

>>218831
> The comics industry in general.
> Salaries
> Viable

You really don't get how this stuff works, do you? That approach only works on stuff like magazines with multiple stories (stuff like Jump over in Japan is basically the only place you'll actually see that happen) and literally un-killanle books like Batman. Even then it's farfetched because it would become a nightmare if you don't just have the same writer on the book each year.

Writing isn't a profession you seek out if you want any form of fiscal security.

>>218828
Sheeeeeeet. That sucks. If you can share and are willing to do so, do you at least get a contract that says they'll commission you for X issues? Or could each new issue you write potentially be your last?

>>218835
>You really don't get how this stuff works, do you?

As well as an industry insider? Nope. But I try to follow the info that's publicly available.
http://thrillbent.com/blog/how-dc-contracts-work/ is a very good summary of industry contracts over the years, although obviously it leaves out a lot, like how the extremely favorable Vertigo contracts are a thing of the past (hence why good new books from Vertigo are a thing of the past), Shooter's role in improving things, Lee's workarounds to try and get creators more steady money despite him having very little real power, those sleazy old checks that had WFH contracts stamped on them so that when a creator endorsed a check they signed away their rights (pic related), etc.

You're right that secure jobs for creators clearly don't really exist in the comics industry, but Marvel/DC have improved things since 1985 or so, so their contracts aren't just a flat-rate-payment. Royalties, reprints, creation rights, etc. got put into play.
(And WB/Disney seem to be trying to turn back the clock to undo that http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/04/16/digital-first-comics-and-straight-work-for-hire-contracts-with-no-royalties/ )
But as people like Steve Bissette and Colleen Doran have attested to (along with a couple guys that worked on the Red Circle 80s push whose names I forget), most of the improvements that happened at Marvel/DC (and Charlton before it folded) didn't happen at Archie. Ken weighed in on the state of things between Marvel/DC vs. Archie back in 2010
http://www.tssznews.com/2010/07/09/penders-flynn-elaborate-on-archie-sonic-comic-row/
Had he stuck to just seeking royalties for reprints, I suspect people would have a very different opinion of him now. The Lara-Su Chronicles were a pretty bizarre deviation from the usual fights over creator rights.
I'd vaguely hoped that with everything that had happened the last few years, Archie might've seen the wisdom in adopting more favorable contracts for creators, but if it's still just lump-sum payments and nothing more then I'm not sure what it would take to serve as a wake-up call for them.

Still, beats the days when Marvel strongarmed Kirby into signing over the Captain America rights for ONE MEASLY DOLLAR.

>>218845
If anything Ken has, most likely, struck a blow towards creator rights if anything. I couldn't see a situation where what he did would ever help anyone, and now readers and creatives alike have more or less been shit on for petty reasons that could have easily been circumvented.

Of course, that doesn't mean anything to the kind of person whose worldview is essentially "Fuck you, got mine."

Hey Ian, have any thoughts about Res Circle? I feel like all the hype and excitement is gone since its been over a year since the Brain Emperor cliff hanger. The Fox as neat but its a side story with really nothing to do with NC

>>218848
Probably not much he can say, since he could hardly say anything negative about the change from "spring 2013" to "spring 2014," and it's starting up again in just a few months so he wouldn't want to give a lot of way. I'm not sure you can assume that The Fox is unrelated though, the character ages seem to match up with what Ian is doing - Fox II got aged up to be "I've got a teenager" old, just like most of the Mighty Crusaders were before Brain Emperor left those teenagers orphaned.

>>218847
Yeah, his actions make it more likely, at least to me, that property owners will take a tighter grip over the work done for them instead of trying to do a nice compensation/royalties system. There really isn't anyone that comes out ahead in this scenario, but I don't think Penders has realized that; even if he wins both cases, he's built up such hatred within the community that only his most ardent fans will buy whatever he makes. The community will shun his Chronicles (not that they were interested in the first place) and now no publisher will touch him for fear that even with an ironclad contract, he will still try to take them to court and cost them money.

I don't know if he was trying to make a point, or just make money, but either way he now bares the black mark.

So are the the Mario and Sonic games canon to the Nu252?

>>218853
>"I don't know if he was trying to make a point, or just make money, but either way he now bares the black mark."

Probably both, with how often he goes on about how evil big companies are and how the little guy deserves everything no matter what.


>>218855
>"So are the the Mario and Sonic games canon to the Nu252?"

Yes. The big twist coming at the end of Countdown to Chaos is that it's actually the start of a Super Mario Galaxy adaptation.

>>218855

>>218855
No. Because if crossover games count, that would mean that characters like the Heavy, Ulala, and Vyse would be part of Nu252, which...

...I mean, Yes.

Speaking on the Red Circle thing, I kinda thing it was a bad decision to base it on the existing Red Circle universe. As someone stepping into it with no prior knowledge of Red Circle (and from my understanding there hasnt been a Red circle since the 80s so thats probably a good chunk of people reading it) its kind of annoying having these back logs about events that happened ages ago. Its kinda like "lets bring these guys from the 50s, 60s, and 70s back, but instead of revitalize them and rework them, we'll just pick off where we left off thirty years ago and hope everyone remembers what happened. Is there even a fanbase for the old stuff?

>>218866
>Is there even a fanbase for the old stuff?

The "Red Circle" output for the 30s/40s/most of the 50s was pretty generic. Not bad or anything, but nothing really standing out either (although The Shield beat Cap to being the first patriotic superhero).

Late 50s/60s they brought in some serious talent in the form of Kirby, Ditko, and the like, and we got The Fly. Then the Red Circle sorta fell off the map. There were still some anthology books done under the Red Circle label, adventure/horror stuff, and some of that was good, but even that died off.

Then in the 80s they had a big push and brought in some people that really knew what they were doing to do "modern day" stories using the old heroes. If you can't find anything you like from the 80s books, notify your family. They deserve to know that you're clinically dead. Storytime related.

Unfortunately Archie seemed to have this idea that if they just threw good creators at their old properties, they'd be competing with DC and Marvel on equal footing in no time flat. When that didn't happen they pulled the plug and got into the habit of just selling someone the Red Circle rights every few years, while doing the occasional "Know Your Red Circle Heroes" story in their books, pretending the characters were still in use by them.

>>218872

>>218873

>>218874

>>218875

>>218878

>>218879

>>218880

>>218881

>>218842
Technically, I live issue to issue. I could walk away in the middle of a story arc, or they could drop me tomorrow. ...y'know, when I put it like that, it sounds terrifying - haha.

>>218848
Actually, the Fox is VERY connected to New Crusaders. A lot of what's shown in the first issue - his wife, son, the Grin Men, Mr. Smile - are all from materials I prepared for "Dark Tomorrow." And I've had solid plans for the first 24 issues. Beyond that, I dunno. It's out of my hands.

>>218866
You'd be surprised how many folks are die-hard fans of the 80s stuff and felt teased by the two DC revamps. The beauty of picking up from the old continuity is that there's tons of room to tell new stories that are perfectly accessible. And if you're the type that likes to drown in archaic comic lore, that's there too. There really wasn't a need to revamp the old stuff.

>>218768
The trouble with the latest issue is that it's entirely awesome. Makes it hard to pick one part to praise. EVERYONE has a crowning moment of awesome.

Well, maybe not Bubble Man. But even Plant Man gets to be awesome in this story.

Is it true the Sonic OVA was originally planned to have 6 to 8 episodes?

I'm sure I read this somewhere, but I can't find any source to confirm one way or another.

>>218899
>Rush learns to walk on his hind limbs
>Nobody notices

Being Rush is suffering.

>>218866
The New Crusaders reminded me of "Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes." There's a lot of backstory in that cartoon that explains that there are a ton of supers in the World and they've been at this for years. In New Crusaders, we see that there was this old generation of heroes and they had villains and stuff, but I didn't need to know every single storyline to know who these people are or what they were doing.

>>218872
>>218897
Thanks for the story time. I'm sure you guys will change my mind on this after I get a chance to read this. Now I'm getting excited for Dark Tomorrow again. Hopefully the Fox will keep coming out in time to keep an appetitie whet (or I just dont forget) when DT comes out

>>218899
I'd say it's not that there was any one moment that screamed for attention, just lots of nice little touches. Gemini-Man arguing with Gemini-Man, Wily To The Rescue, the general creepiness of the bots under Ra Moon's control, the "MEANWHILE..." scene with Light and other Robot Masters

The Ra Moon arc's been great.

I wonder... did Antoine EVER wear his old uniform in the new continuity, or has he been shirtless all along?

This is the sort of question that haunts me now.

>>218899
The real trouble with the latest issue is the schedule means a lot of people don't have it, or don't want to talk spoilers. All the feedback sounds positive and the art looks like it's improved, but damn if the suscribers or shop get to see that yet.

>>218924
You may as well ask if Sally was pink in the new continuity.

Super Special Magazine 9 is out for any of you eager to read up about the new continuity.

>>218964
Does he have to redo the entire timeline from scratch now?

>>218964
Does anyone buy this thing? theres always huge stacks at every store I go to that sells it.

>>218976
No idea, but it'll get a few sales until someone finally leaks the darn thing.

It's official.* Sally can shoot laser beams from her hands.

*Not actually official yet.

>>218964
It says things about the new continuity? I'll be buying the magazine again it seems.

>>218986
Nothing major.
Mostly cosmetic junk and semi-spoilers.

>Promise new content that tells us about the new universe
>Wow its fucking nothing

Do you not want people to buy these Magazines? Where's the CONTENT?

>>218997
The magazine is just a preview of their other books for kids. It literally exists to advertise, rather than sell itself.

This is the most substantial content they've ever given us.

>>219000
More substantial than the original timeline in issues 1-4? please. I'm gonna need to see proof of that.

>>219002
>The timelines
You mean the blurbs of retcon text that didn't actually explain much of anything and are completely wasted now? Yeah, I'd say previews of Black Death and Eclipse alongside a few hints toward big future events is substantial in comparison.

Now, what WAS substantial in the past were data files. Stuff like when they talked about the history of Enerjak. Stuff like that's vaguely touched on in the original timeline, but not much.

>>219002
The one clearly made for the Encyclopedia but reused to try and shove some reason for people to buy the Magazine?

So hey, whatever happened to that Afterlife with Archie zombie book? I was and still am really interested in reading that.

>>219016
The second issue's not out until next week, but yeah it's pretty good stuff. It's got a very tense horror atmosphere that I usually don't think comics can replicate.

>>219016
I'm not sure how they did it - maybe it's the "wholesome" image that Archie had built up, or the way the characters have lasted so long that we all kind of know them and they have a timeless feel, maybe it's a fantastic ear for dialog and feel for pacing, maybe it's the art, maybe it's all the above - but the stuff that's come out so far has made for better and creepier horror than any comic I've read in yeeeeeeaaaars.

'Sgood.

Hey guys.

>>219016
What do you mean, what happened? It's out. It's actually interesting. The dialogue seems a good step up from the usual "Archie" fare.

>>219037
Might've been nice to spoiler the thumbnail....but I gotta say I am actually interested in this guy.

He already looks a ton more interesting than any of the Black Arms games designs.

>>219037
He looks way better than I thought, the description made him sound terrible. That guy looks like a fun baddie minion.

Name's still dumb, but I guess with Black Arms that's what you expect.

>>219044
What description?

I don't know why people are ragging on the name so much.....all Sonic characters have these kinds of names. If he's supposed to be in theme with Shadow, I can't think of a lot of options that wouldn't get the same reaction. Dark? Umbra? Shade is already taken (even though thanks to Penders we'll probably never see her).

Plus this is based on a group of enemies that were lead by a guy named BLACK DOOM. I mean c'mon....

>>219046
PENUMBRA!

Nope, people will think of bras and Penders.

>>219046
Doesn't start with an "S". Sonic, Shadow, Scourge, and Eclipse. You lose the alliteration. Sorry, seriously should've selected Sombra.

>>219049
The S names only apply to the hedgehogs... he's not a hedgehog. If anything he looks like the Black Arms mutated a dark chao.

>>219049
I hope your alliteration was intentional. Anyway, I just imagine Bronies rising up in an angry wave if something else used "Sombra."

>Sonic
>Shadow
>Silver
>Scourge
>Shard

How the flying fuck did I not notice this.

>>219053
>Amy
>Not Samy
>Fails at being a Hedgehog

So Sally's superior? Spectacular.

>>219055
Only guys get the S.

>>219056

>>219057
I know what I said.

>>219052
I feel like this would just lead to stupid jokes. Sum-Bra the Alienthing. Sombrero.

>>219058
Slander!

>>219059
>I feel like this would just lead to stupid jokes.

In SONIC?

>>219046
Eclipse the Darling is a dumb name. I get what it's going for and I agree that it fits the Black Arms. It's just silly.

>>219070
I dunno, he seems like a darling to me. :3c

>>219057
>that body
Terrifying

>>219073
It's Rouge with a Sonic head, weird hair, and weird clothes.

>>219071
>>219070
Well that seals it, he's Eclipse the Darling from now on.

=3

>>219074
>Weird hair
What's weird about it?

>>219085
It's outrageous, I tell you.

Hey, Mega Man 34's solicit came out!
>The road to the next big mega-crossover starts here
fuckfuckFuckFUCKFUCKFUCK

>>219128

Oh for fucks sake.

>>219128
Ugh.

>>219128
Shadow of the Moon sounds interesting, and "the next big crossover" appears to just be something involving X. Possibly him paying a visit to the past?

Poor Wily. This is why you don't trust strange alien tech you find laying around. Well, at least he's learned his lesso...

Oh for crying out loud.

>>219135
I've been begging for Sungod to fight Ra Moon since we first heard they were adapting SAR.

Behold, the true face of horror.

>>219137
I don't remember this being in SSS15.

>>219138
That's because we've all scrubbed it from our memory so it wouldn't drive us to madness.

>>219137
>Like a sixth of the picture obscured by a giant fucking bar.
...why?

This is it! The issue every Mega-fan has been demanding! The debut of Mega Man X! But first, in 'Shadow of the Moon' Part One: Mega Man joins a research team seeking the truth behind Dr. Wily and Ra Moon. But how far will they get when Shadow Man goes on the attack? Then, in 'The X Factor' Part One: jump 100 years into the future as Dr. Cain discovers Dr. Light's final, greatest creation - Mega Man X! Featuring pencils by the returning Mega Man art legend Patrick 'Spaz' Spaziante! The road to the next big mega-crossover starts here, featuring an exclusive Mega Man X variant cover by superstar artist Ben Bates!

>The road to the next big Mega-Crossover
>Mega-Crossover
>Cross Over
>X Over

>>219136

Maybe in six years when the comic finally advances far enough to do that.

>>219141
I would be really happy if it was that.
Better than a Classic/X crossover this soon.

So apparently today's solicits were incorrect and Theta isn't going to be part of the upcoming arc.

Sometimes I feel like they put the wrong ones up on purpose so they can just tell us less about the upcoming issues than they would have to otherwise. The incorrect info is always so drastically different from the final result that it's hard to believe it was ever anything more than throwing random words in as filler until the story is finalized.

Maybe it's a Megaman/Archie's Super Teens crossover.
Leading up to the announcement of Archie Comics vs Capcom

It doesn't necessarily have to interrupt any monthlies, right?

>>219150
I'd be totally fine with this and would honestly prefer it to X/Classic.

In fact, I'd llike to see something dumb, like X/Red Circle.

>>219155
Worlds Collide was going to interrupt the monthlies even before Archie went into panic mode with the Sonic book. You tell me how likely that is.

If they launch a second book as the "crossover" book and then convert it into a Mega Man X book if the sales are good, kind of like Sonic X...I could totally see it happening that way.

>>219141

Xover is of course a twat game for twats, but Over-1 himself wouldn't necessarily be poison in the comic. He would if it stuck the game's canon, of course. But as a sort of Zonic zhe Zedgehog role that facilitated crossovers he could work.

Having read Afterlife with Archie today, I'd just like to say GNYAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!

>>219185
Issue one and two?

So... Are we going to see the cataclysm?

>>219245
Isn't that just a thing in Bob and George?

>>219245
No.

Inafune flatly rejected the very idea of a "cataclysm".

>>219248
Basically.

>>219248

Bob and George popularized the idea and gave it the name but people had already thought of the idea.

The less said about Bob and George the better though.

>>219250
N4T3
The Author
Ran
Purple-Bird-Not-Slashman-That-Turns-Into-A-Purple-Devil

You can't escape your past, anon.

>>219251
I'm inordinately happy that everything you just typed is meaningless gibberish to me.

>>219250

Agreed. I mean, I enjoyed the comic for what it was during its time, but the way some people treat it like the definitive version... ugh.

Just the very utterance of the word "Cataclysm" in relation to Mega Man makes me shudder.

>>219252
>He doesn't know about Ran, the Cossack Bot.
Loser.

>>219251

You forgot gray Sigma and red Proto shield using Mega Man.

>>219249
Guess who doesn't work at Capcom anymore?

>>219253
Some day they will be finished.
Some day.

>>219257
Sorry, are you siding with Capcom over Infune over Mega Man?

His point was that the Classic stuff is fun and a bit on the cutesy side, and that it would be a massive betrayal of tone to show something horrible happening to them. The background with X is basically "time passed, stuff happened, and now the world's seen better days."

>>219262
this coming from the series where a ton of people just died

>>219270

They all had parachutes! I saw them.

>>219270
You DO realize that's why he was unhappy with SAR, right?

There's seriously no reason to show what happened to any Classic era characters to bring in X. Honestly, it's a really twisted thing to say you want to see in the book, about as tonally deaf as it gets.

>>219277
Well x is only 100 years in the future. Mega is a robot, hence he and the others should still be around. But there not. What happened? Some people wanna know

>>219282
>Whatever happened to Amuro?
>Fuck you that's irrelevant
>Sure okay

>Whatever happened to the hero who cleared the miasma?
>Fuck you that's irrelevant
>Sure okay

>Whatever happened to OoT Link?
>Fuck you that's irrelevant
>Bu-but...okay...

>Whatever happened to Rock?
>Fuck you that's irrelevant
>BUT I WAAAANNAAA KNOOOOOOW

It isn't addressed because:

A. There's no point. Classic is a series of light-hearted adventures made for funsies. Rock's ultimate fate isn't our damn business. May as well ask how Mickey dies.

B. It doesn't add anything to the narrative. X and Classic are segregated for a reason. They're entirely different kinds of series and aren't meant to mix naturally. The only reason Classic-ZX is one long timeline is for the sake of cute references for fans. Each series (ZX possibly exempt due to Zero getting a conclusive ending and Capcom wanting more handheld Mega Man games) is created mostly in a vacuum. They take cues from old games in the other series, but their tone, world, and identity are self-sustained and inherently different from each other.

X is basically the "next step" to the classic series, adding new gameplay elements to the existing formula. Zero takes it a step further by redefining the weapons system and adding RPG elements. The entire Mega Man franchise only links games chronologically whenever they share similar gameplay or are part of the same sub-series. Battle Network/StarForce and Legends live in bubbles because they don't share common gameplay. Or, in other words, the fact that Classic to ZX is one timeline is irrelevant because each series lives in its own little bubble, adding references as fanservice and building blocks for greater context. Breaching these bubbles so thoroughly as to write the end of one series for the purpose of giving false closure and linking more heavily with another is both disrespectful of their shared space and counter-intuitive. Even Rockman Online was planning on having X and Classic series characters warped into a mutual future point in space/time in order to not breach these bubbles (IE, the kind of thing a crossover would do).

C. Classic and X are open-ended franchises. Capcom can return to them at any point to continue making games for them. Archie will most likely want to continue making stories for both series indefinitely. Showing Mega Man's ultimate demise is counter-intuitive to all of this.

D. It would make people really sad.

You wanna see Rock kick it? Write your own fanfiction.

>>219282
And I guarantee you they're vastly outnumbered by the people that don't want to see the Classic cast die. Especially since those deaths would be not just noncanon but faaaaaar from canon (the book so far is close in broad strokes, but what you're asking for is so far it hurts).

Just... no.

>>219283
There really isn't much Archie could do with a MMZ book, is there? They'd just do the games and maybe some stuff in-between. Just makes me want to see an adaptation of the Zero games as backups/stories in an X book, later re-released in one big volume as "MEGAMAN ZERO: COMPLETE ARCHIVE".

I'd buy it.

Thinking about the Sonic characters we're reasonably certain are fair game, it occurs to me that recent developments put a very different spin on Uncle Beauregard. In the old continuity, with "King Max," you could sort of understand Beauregard's feelings about the Acorns. But the NuKing Acorn seems to be a good man and a good leader that just made a couple bad calls. Beauregard looks kind of like a weenie for adopting a hardline anti-Acorn stance. Pity, I liked the "A Pox On Both Your Houses" setup with Bunnie and 'Twain's families.

>>219283
>Even Rockman Online was planning on having X and Classic series characters warped into a mutual future point in space/time

My understanding was that they were all meant to be clones. Somehow. Even thought that doesn't make much sense. The future villains cloned a bunch of old villains so the future good guys cloned a bunch of old heroes to even the scales.

>>219286
It was that, but the ACTUAL characters were also going to show up due to time/space bullshit. Which is why you see the REAL Mega Man and REAL Proto Man in the trailers.

>>219283
Legends is in the classic timeline.

Didn't you know that?

>>219288
I'm gonna need a source on that. All the promotional material said that it was going to just be Robot replicas of robots

>>219290
I honestly forgot.

So we got some nice big images of #258s cover

http://tysonhesse.deviantart.com/art/Sonic-the-Hedgehog-258-414449778


Interesting note, Antoine is wearing a wedding ring in the original version.

>>219303
>"Interesting note, Antoine is wearing a wedding ring in the original version."
And he isn't in the final?

>>219304
Only other pic is a teeny-tiny titchy little thing. Anyone claiming they can tell the ring isn't there is delusional.

>>219304
Well, from the covers that we've seen, shrinking the original artwork down to the same size as the official cover you should still see the ring.

My verdict, maybe it's been edited out.

>>219309
Funny, because to me the ring finger looks like it has some odd miscoloring there on the close-up of the final. It's almost like it's ring-colored.

But like >>219308 said, it's way to small to tell for sure either way. Either of us could be completely imagining things.

Either way, we saw Bunnie wearing a ring in the previous cover (though not anymore?) it's not like it's going to meaningfully affect their relationship in anyway.

>>219312
This. Married in this world or not, Antoine still loves Bunnie and called her his wife. That's what really matters in the end.

Guys Mighty and Ray aren't on the cover, that means Sega murdered them, panic panic panic!

>>219325
no
NO

>>219325

More likely the Chaotix are now their game counterparts and thus have no reason to hang out with Mighty, Ray or Knuckles.

Mighty and Ray might be reintroduced someday by themselves though.

>>219330
That is one heck of a hopskipjump to conclusions there, bucko.
Almost on the level of "Amy's not on the FF covers, she must not be a Freedom Fighter anymore."

I doubt definitively bridging Classic and X is something Ian would be allowed to do. And I doubt he wants to, since no matter how he goes about it he's going to make a lot of people mad.

Maybe one day, if the comic has some longevity and both Classic and X stories can earn their keep. But for right now I predict he'll just try not close any doors.

I SUSPECT I know how he might personally lean on the subject of what happened to Rock, but we've been over that before and I didn't make any friends doing it.

>>219331
>Comic sidelining with the games
>Mighty and Ray are not Chaotix in the games
>Neither is Knuckles
>Hey guys the Chaotix are probably just going to be Espio, Charmy and Vector in the comic, and Mighty and Ray will be their own thing
>WHOOOA THERE THERE'S NO LOGIC TO THAT AT ALL

>>219348
>Hey guys it sure sucks that the MM2 bots are never coming back
>Too bad that Knuckles won't get to do anything in the crossover and Shadow was completely written out
>Sonic will never call Chuck "Uncle" again or have any kind of emotional scenes with him
>It's so lame that Antoine and Bunnie won't be married anymore

>>219348
There's not even anything to suggest Knux isn't keeping a relation with the Chaotix. Even the cover we're supposedly using as a base for assumptions has him right next to the other three members.

Did anyone save the Alt cover to #258 that Tyson Hesse posted on his Twitter? Apparently it was removed because Mighty, Ray, Sleuth Dawg among others were on it too. He's not allowed to post it anywhere again or something.

>>219348
You really can't have a comic with the Freedom Fighters in it and claim characters' appearances in the book will be determined by how much they're used in the games.

>>219359
Ty working on Sonic, how nostalgic.

>>219359
Well it would probably be stupid to start working for a company and then make it look like said company is having you draw things that will get Ken Penders' panties in a twist.

>>219359
That sure sounds like a load of baloney.

>>219349
To be fair on the Uncle point, the only reason Sonic can call him Uncle is because everyone does. SEGA has a sniper lined up the moment Ian implies Chuck is Sonic's parent's brother

>>219361
Wait a minute... was he on Fireball20xl?

>>219366
No, they have a "you can't print this, change it" lined up the moment he has someone outright call Chuck his Uncle. Implications be damned. Sega has never been shown to give a single fuck about implications (sup cap'n metal). They care about cold, hard facts that could interfere with marketing.

>>219357
Did anyone say hw wasn't going to keep a relation to the Chaotix, or even Mighty and Ray?

Just saying, it'll likely fall in line with the games and be The Chaotix (Espio, Vector, Charmy), who are friends with Knuckles, Mighty, Ray; Rather than The Chaotix (Espio, Vector, Charmy, Knuckles, Mighty, Ray).

>We know what's going on

>>219359
He never posted the old cover, only said that there was one. He made a post saying "GUYS SLEUTH IS GONE", and that post is gone. Every other post he made on it is still up. In fact, the one thing he did say about Mighty and Ray is that they aren't off-limits.

>>219359
Stop posting obvious misinformation.

>>219381

Most people do stuff like this just to be assholes. Unfortunately, the dumb or the needlessly paranoid latch onto every word and make places like this one unbearable to be at.

>>219377
He also discreetly implied they can't use Larry right now, but the obvious answer to that is "no shit, Archie probably isn't allowing the use of ANYTHING they're unsure of right now".

>>219387
Pretty much. Plus, there's the fact that he deleted the Sleuth tweet and not the Larry one (which was so vauge it could've meant anything anyway), so probably not much to read into with it.

>>219367
What do you mean "was"?
http://boxerhockey.fireball20xl.com/

>>219392
I did not know boxerhockey is fireball20xl. What were some of the older comics he did there?

>>219404
Pretty sure it was just Sonic Argh.
I might be mistaken.

>Psyguy still makes That's My Sonic

HOLY SHIT

>>219411
Just let him be, anon.
Just let him be.

>Afterlife with Archie 2 shows Nancy (Chuck's love interest) has apparently dumped Chuck to date Ginger

Smartest thing she's ever done.

I'll miss Blaze. That was fun.

>>219303
>>219309
Full-sized covers are out. No worries, Antoine still has the ring.

>>219495
What an oddly generic arc name.

>>219496

Arc names have never been Ian's forte.

>>219496
>>219500
I really don't see how it's an issue....?

>>219502
Of course it is.
It's Issue 258

>>219502
We're 258 issues in, and yet the arc title and even artwork almost make it look like a fanmade cover.

It's not really a problem, but it makes me wonder why the hell it's so generic.

Why can't he make the top half long, too.

>>219505
Having not read the solit (is it out?), I imagine The Chase is about world-building and setup, leading into grander things; a Two Towers, if you will. So the effort spent on it is fairly low so that attentions can turn to working on the more grandiose arcs.

>>219507
I would agree on the "set up" part, but basically it's about Uncle Chuck and Prof Pickle getting kidnapped and transported on a train and the FF trying to intercept them. So they're being "chased" down. I say world building because I don't think these characters in particular would both get kidnapped just for ransom or whatever. I think Eggman wants info.

>>219505
>the arc title...almost makes it look like a fanmade cover.
Ian's arc names have always been this bad.
The comic in general has had TERRIBLE names for story arcs and issues.

This isn't new.

>>219514
I feel like I'm missing something here. It's nothing all that notable, but how is it that bad? I mean what the hell is a good comic book title?

The step names in Treasure Team Tango were cute I thought, otherwise I don't really remember the titles.

>>219516
Ok I'm not saying it's bad. I'm just saying something seems off. The whole generic arc of Sonic running, Robotnik yelling, and all his friends behind him combined with that arc title almost makes it seem like it's the first issue of a new comic. Maybe since this is a soft reboot that's what he's going for. Who knows.

...

My God I love how Jampole draws EVERYTHING.

>>219506

I KNOW, RIGHT?

It's Sonic, totally Sonic. I am Sonicked UP!

>>219527
I thought he was terrible. Eggy had the same expression in every panel

>>219541
Apparently that was a rush job, though. I dunno, I'm optimistic. His work on Mega Man grew in leaps and bounds, so I'm thinking with some practice he could adapt to Sonic eventually.

>>219541
Jampole is really good at drawing machines (his Orbot and Cubot look great) and not so great at drawing fleshy things.
Wells is good at drawing fleshy things but not so great at robots (his Orbot and Cubot are a bit dreadful).

By their powers combined...

>Listening to prelaw students talking loud about licensing and copyright
>One mentions how a company licensed a cartoon character, added a hat to his likeness, then successfully sued another company with the character's license for selling merchandise using the likeness with the hat
>Hear that sort of thing happens a lot, with toy companies suing one another for licensed toys that look too similar

Ohhhhhhhhh...

>>219541
>Eggy had the same expression in every panel

Things were going his way, so he sported a creepy wide grin for most of the time, but come off it.

I've seen discussion recently centered about how the current satam cast are "too perfect" and that makes them bland.

Do you think that's the case?

What would you list as their current personality flaws?

>>219563
>What would you list as their current personality flaws?

Erm... Well they've barely appeared, but... does Sally not having her cheek fuzz count as a personality flaw?

I'm used to The King having enough flaws for a dozen people, but I guess now he's as good a leader as Lupe.

...I guess theoretically there might be a time when Rotor's "Slap more guns on there. No, BIGGER guns" approach might be bad?

>>219563
Antione's shifted from being too cowardly to being too vain, arrogant, and careless. Hopefully with hints of meekness.

Bunnie's way too dependent on what other people think and about being useful, so she's prone to doing more than she needs to and possibly overextending herself. Nu!Bunnie might have different flaws.

Rotor's basically a barely defined character in every continuity, but the new one's problem might be that he's too forward in his approach (like another anon said "WHY DON'T WE JUST MAKE A BIGGER GUN, SONIC, THAT WILL SOLVE ALL OUR PROBLEMS").

Sally's always been a very (mentally) fragile individual in some sense of the word. Most of the comic's run she's been tiptoeing the line between absurdly incredible selflessness and a full-on martyr complex. Doesn't help that the old Sally had daddy issues.

I'm anxious about the fact that the new crew seems like it might be a bit /too/ hotheaded, like they don't have enough diversity in their flaws. I really hope Antione keeps some of his skittishness, because otherwise we might have three characters on the team whose biggest flaws come down to "man he sure doesn't think things through does he".

Nicole barely has any flaws right now, so I'm hoping for a return to her sassy comments.

>>219577
At least if Bunnie, Rotor and Twan are all too forward and "hotheaded" that will make Sally's leadership skills much more important.

>>219577
For what it's worth, that's more or less how Antoine was originally, anyway. Well, in Archie, at least. Less cowardly, more arrogant.

>>219563
I think it's really stupid to make any sweeping statements OR judgements on the "current SatAM" cast when we haven't even seen them all, and what little we HAVE seen was just a basic re-introduction.

That said, I wouldn't be surprised if Antoine is still a bit skittish, but I like the arrogance because at least now he actually has something to back it up with. Way back on the day he was mostly useless if not the source of a lot of problems, and the cowardly French stereotype was incredible lame and dated.

>>219565
>I'm used to The King having enough flaws for a dozen people, but I guess now he's as good a leader as Lupe.

In a surprise twist, Lupe now gains all Max's bad leadership skills.

I hope Antoine isn't skittish anymore. That part of his character are has already played out. He's gotten over being scared.

>>219615
He was still skittish as recently as two years ago.
There's a difference between "MON DIEU IT IS A SPIDER ZUT ALORS HONHONHONBAGUETTE" and getting a bit spooked.

>>219622
Right. If Antoine was just arrogant and confident because he's got the skill to back it up... he'd be Sonic.

>>219623
That's actually one of the things I'm a bit scared of; the possibility of the retooled Antione and Rotor's biggest faults being too similar to Sonic's major faults. The core cast is best when they play on each other's strengths and weaknesses, so it'd be a bit weird if nearly half of them had similar problems.

>>219632
Good thing you're the ONLY person who will ever think of such things.

>>219623
Not really?
Sonic is proud, but he isn't stare at yourself goo-goo eyes in the mirror vain.

I think being a scaredy cat is as essential to Ants character as being fat is to Rotor.

Without it, he's an arrogant, slightly snobbish guy with a gentile romantic heart at his core. Which doesn't seem very Sonic like to me ?

Is Eggman still a feminist?

Afterlife with Archie... just read the first two issues and WOW. I found myself holding my breath at points. That is just one RIDICULOUSLY good book.

>>219641
A scaredy cat?
Yeah.

Being a bit skittish and meek at times?
Nah. That's a big part of who he is. Regardless of how courageous he is, Antione is usually less outgoing than Sonic, a more reserved alternative. More cautious. Being more easily startled than the others is as much a part of his character as Rotor being smart. Completely discarding his roots in timidity is like making Sonic stop being a snarky jerk, or trying to say Sally isn't bossy.

And Antione is a better defined and more consistent character than Rotor overall, so it's not a great comparison to begin with.

>>219634
Sorry for expressing concern that the book could end up disjointed again in the wake of a major shake up. I assume it won't be like that, but I don't think it's unreasonable to be concerned that the core characters might not work as well off each other.

>>219653
I don't think I agree. I don't think characters should be caught in a rut with how they're expected to to be. Antoine should be allowed grow as a character out of being skittish.

Sort of like Daddy Issues with Sally. Some people would say it is a core facet of her character, since it's been with her since satam. But I have no problem with her outgrowing it as a character, I think it would be positive, and wouldn't make her too much like Amy or Blaze or other female characters, because she's more than one trait.

I suppose the aspect I find most necessary is the idea it's necessary to keep lingering figments. For what sake? Just to remind the reader that he used to be a cheese eating surrender moneky?

>>219658
The problem is that your comparison is horribly flawed.

Antione's easily startled nature is basically one of the essential building blocks in defining who he is on such a fundamental level that suddenly cutting it out of him is irresponsible. It's like ripping Sonic's sarcasm out of him in one fell swoop. There's nothing inherently wrong with that development, but just suddenly discarding a major element of who he is out of him for no logical reason isn't good writing. Even as recently as when we last saw him he had these traits, he was just also brave and able to prioritize his job.

Sally, on the other hand...well, the stuff with her dad hadn't really been apparent in her character for a good few years. Yeah, her dad was still a jerk, but it wasn't part of what defined her for some time now. When you have the kind of organic growth Sally's had and a status quo shakeup like King Acorn NOT being a huge jerk, then yeah, it makes sense to phase stuff like that out.

>Why should he keep that?
Because, as you said, a character is more than just one trait. Just because that trait is born out of a time when the character was portrayed as a huge jerk doesn't mean it should just be whisked away. It either needs to wither away due to organic growth or persist as a part of who the character is, evolving over time.

There's no sense in stripping character traits out because "I don't like that part". Characters have good and bad qualities when it comes to their personality. When you have a character as popular and well defined as Antione, selectively chucking old traits because "it's played out" is amateurish. The way to reshape characters with care and skill is to simply focus on the aspects you feel are important and develop them.

TL;DR - Antione isn't any worse of a character just because he's the most likely to squeal when a giant robot is chasing him. If anything it rounds out his character and gives more context. It shows you that he's more openly emotional (at least in some respects) than other people, and it even underlines the internal strength he possesses to remain courageous despite his fear. It also facilitates greater emotional response from the audience. Some people find it endearing, some people find it annoying, but regardless it summons a stronger response than if he was just the arrogant vain guy who loves his wife.

Super TL;DR - There's a difference between the visual (he's fat), personal (he's fearful), and mental (she's caught up on her dad's opinions) aspects of a character, and there's different contexts to consider for changing different aspects.

>>219665
I'm sorry I'm not convinced. I don't agree with your premises that being scared is a fundamental to his character as you believe it is.

I mean, for starters I don't think visual physical/mental attributes are less important than other traits. For instance it's more important to Sonic being Sonic that he is blue, has quills and red shoes than any personal attribute.

But more to the point every character has personality wise evolved over time naturally. Even Sonic I would say lost his snark for a few big games, but he didn't stop being sonic just because of it.

You've made the wrong conclusion in thinking because I don't want Ant to be skittish that I hate characters that show fear. That's not true, I find it can be very endearing for a lot for the reasons you stated. And without it there would not even be the foundation for character growth that makes Antoine's personal character arc so great in my opinion.

But clinging to the past to preserve traits that the characters have grown out of just for clinging to the past sake seems wrong and just arrests characters possible character growth potential.

>Even as recently as when we last saw him he had these traits

You mean in 254?... Not really? I didn't observe any fear/skittishness from Ant in that issue. And it was still a great issue and Ant was still his own character.

The last time I remember Ant truly being skittish was during the Tails Adventure arc.

>>219672
I know you guys are having a nice little tete-a-tete and all, but

>The last time I remember Ant truly being skittish was during the Tails Adventure arc.
>Antione appears all of four times in any notable fashion between then and now.
>One of those occasions was being a huge coward for Genesis.
>One was a callback to issue 40, another was his sacrifice, and the last one was him showing up again.

You may as well say "The last time I remember Sally being a leader was 225, haven't we moved on yet?" Can't point at the last instance of him being a coward being three years old when he's only been conscious once in nearly two years.

>>219680
Yes, well it's not something I would have brought up if I wasn't replying to this line

>Even as recently as when we last saw him he had these traits

Not that it feels nice to bring this back again and again, but have a post nicely compiling everything about the Penders case in a timeline.

http://theamazingsallyhogan.tumblr.com/post/68112487973/sonic-the-hedgehog-ken-penders-bioware-electronic

Worth the read to gain some perspective.

I've gotta say, I much much MUCH prefer Antoine when he's more prone to showing fear than the others.

Look, it's simple... what's more impressive, the guy that faces danger while feeling no fear, or a guy that faces danger despite the fact that he's breaking out in a cold sweat while his heart pounds 200 times per minute? Give me the Antoine that's way more liable to get scared than the others, but who charges into battle anyway.

New info from Ian (Topic contains spoilers for #255) :
http://bumbleking.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=371816

- Bunnie and Antoine have been married in both versions of the universe.
- Ahklut is no longer the Arctic Egg Boss, but he's been reassigned to another region of the world.
- A character working for Eggman in #255 who went unnamed (people have been nicknaming him Tassel Boy because of his tasseled shoulderpads) is not an Egg Boss, and remained nameless in the issue for a reason.

>>219692
I'm pretty sure that when he said "he's nameless for a reason" he meant "he's incidental, there's no reason to give him a name."

Also, Ahklut is probably the Oceanic Egg Boss now.

>>219693
>"I'm pretty sure that when he said "he's nameless for a reason" he meant "he's incidental, there's no reason to give him a name." "
Yeah, probably. Still, guy had a neat design, at least.

Hips.
Thighs.
Bazongers.

That is all.

>>219694
I'd like him to show up every once in a while as "that one guy". You know. That guy who shows up, that nobody really cares about or knows, that just keeps coming back even though nobody even knows his name.

Running gag characters are fun sometimes.

>>219695
You forgot Clamp-style.
I kinda like Gaylord's art, but he needs to fix his limbs. They're all over the place.

>>219692
So Tassel Boy is a character Ian can't use but wants to shove in there so he can introduce him when he's available?

>>219701
More likely what >>219693 said, that he's just a nameless mook who happened to get a few lines and a neat enough design for people to think he was important.

>>219701
>>219703

Tassel-Fett?

>Even when Bunnie is getting visions of her old life... no hat

This is the weirdest thing I've ever overreacted and called a mandate.

>>219708
To be fair she didn't have her hat in the original scenes either.

Autosage hit. New thread: >>219734