But what makes it different

Noooot gonna comment on this.

the intention is noble, but I fear it'll wind up being misguided.

I'm going to save myself some time and copy+paste a post from my friend's blog.

>Okay I’ve been wanting to make this post for a while but I was afraid of the backlash - but at this point, fuck that. I need to say something.

>The Arkh Project is not going to go anywhere and I feel really fucking bad for anyone who has donated money because they’re not going to see any results. It’s a really noble cause - games today lack queer characters and persons of color and the project was striving to create a game that would fill that void.

>From a very cursory glance it’s pretty clear the people heading it don’t know what they’re doing. They do not even have a design document yet, and they are already asking for money. This is incredibly suspect to me. There is no design document, no art document, no technical document. These are basic parts of making a game that are pretty much mandatory to have before you even think about funding. If you don’t have these basic detailed documents saying exactly what you’re doing, you should not be asking for donations. The only thing The Arkh Project has to show is concept art. That is it. Everything else is talk and blog posts from the people working on the project. This is not nearly enough to justify even considering asking for money, even for donations.

>It is pretty clear from going over their blog, even in their gameplay tag, that they have put little to no thought into gameplay. The only things I could find were about the experience points system, combining herbs, and a lot about the characters and the plot. But nothing else. What is the combat in Arkh going to be like? I couldn’t tell you, because even though fighting monsters seems to be a large part of the game, the only thing I saw was:

>"The goal is an action RPG, meaning that you have to be good at hitting buttons at the right times to kill monsters."

>Ah. Yes. Very descriptive.

>Look - the intentions of this project are wonderful. Queer persons and people of color are lacking in the game industry. But I can’t support or give money or even advise other people to give money to something like this. They are taking advantage of people, if they realize it or not, plain and simple.

>The other major grievance I have with this project is the individual, Riley, who seems to be heading it. This is the person who runs “dumbthingswhitepplsay” and I can’t possibly support this if they’re involved, and you shouldn’t either. This is someone who makes posts to the tune of “shut the fuck up, white women”, who calls persons of color who disagree with them “white-identifying”, has literally told LGBTQ youth to kill themselves because they were white, and ridiculed a girl with a physical deformity and told her to kill herself.

>Do you want to support someone who makes comments like that? Who is completely fucking two-faced and trying to make a game that’s positive for people of color while simultaneously posting incredibly racist things to their blog?

>If I seem angry it’s because I am. Arkh has raised over $5,000 so far. This project is going to crash and burn because nobody they are working with has the skill to pull this off - their scope is too big and they don’t know anything about the game development process. And I’m willing to bet the people who donated are not going to see a single penny back when this project inevitably goes under.

>Support indie game designers, by all means, but support them when they know what they’re doing, and when they’re actually good people who practice what they preach.

DO NOT SUPPORT THIS

They have NO actual plans and direction.
And the main person behind it is an all around heinous person.

Also that particular donation site allows the people to keep the money even if they dont reach their goal.

A much better worded argument can be found here.
http://ardeb.tumblr.com/post/16890249680/

Whoa, all that money from some fancy words and pictures? Hmmm.

>>146194
>>146195
It's funny, /v/ had a big thread about this earlier which was nothing but "Fuck this shit because it's about niggers and queers" with not a single good argument in it.

/cog/ > /v/ THANK. YOU.

So it has to be a gay white guy and an ambivalent dark skinned girl? I don’t see what could come of this even if they did have the means to pull it off. Especially if from the ground up the first thought put into a character is BE GAY OR ETHNICALLY DIFFERENT.

>>146204
That REALLY shouldn't be the only reason to make a game, or any story for that matter, unless it's specifically about those issues, which I highly doubt a fantasy RPG would seriously deal with.
It just seems like a tagline to guilt well-meaning people to give all their money to some assholes running a scam.

Really if you wanted to do a game like this it's simple.

Make a good game and have your main character be gay or a minority... there.

You don't need any more thought in it than that. You can bring up his sexuality when it's pertinent, you extrapolate that yes he is _____________ nationality when it's necessary. But selling yourself as "THE FIRST GAY PROTAGONIST" or "THE FIRST BLACK PROTAGONIST" is selling yourself short and it seems more like you're riding on the gimmick of being a different sexual orientation/race rather than actually being thoughtful or profound.

As long as you approach it maturely and with the right idea of what kind of societal pressures one might encounter in the setting (if it's based on a real-world setting. Fantasy has shit go all-out) then you can write it out with all that in mind.

the zybourne arkh

A casually gay character in an infinitely better indie game.

Oh, look. A non-white protagonist in a mainstream video game series!

>>146231
UNPOSSIBLE!

> that whole post about “shut up white women” shouldn’t even be in there as a problem, considering what they were talking about. Cuz I mean, if you think them saying shit about white people’s privilege is racist then we’re done.
Barriers to reality and sanity all over the place. Tumblr, don't bite the hand of the person trying to protect you.

>>146204
>So it has to be a gay white guy and an ambivalent dark skinned girl?

Worked for Resident Evil 5.

Another good write-up of the whole thing.
http://hradzka.dreamwidth.org/427926.html
From the article:
>Kickstarter doesn't let you keep the money if you fall short of your goal. IndieGoGo does. This is explicitly why the Arkh project chose IndieGoGo.

Wow. I can't wait for the inevitable Fandom Wank post, which will probably be equal parts entertaining and disgusting.

>>146231
>>146232
Hey now guys, let's not go acting like they don't have a point. A handful of examples doesn't mean that video games aren't dominated by same old same old.

And it seems that they are trying to address the central issue: http://thearkhproject.tumblr.com/post/16772053171/but-will-arkh-be-a-good-game This is certainly better than "it's an RPG with minorities," but the way they're going about this still doesn't inspire much confidence. Saying they want good gameplay and creating good gameplay are two different things, as the entire industry is repeatedly and painfully showing us.

I can't help but see this as a prime example of how indie projects shouldn't be done. What we have here is somebody/some people with a vague concept begging for money so they can supposedly commission other people to do their work for them, with no indication that they are trustworthy or even have the skill sets to manage such a thing. Not a good sign of longevity.

On another note: Aren't sexuality and ethnicity considered minor character traits unless they're actively addressed? It's wishful thinking, but I'd like to imagine the lack of gay/non-Caucasian characters in video games could be attributed to a desire not to agitate those audiences with poorly conceived stereotypes that exist only to fill in a niche. Nothing's wrong with diversity, it's just one of those things that need to handled with care.

Sexuality and ethnicity aren't important as characteristics, they're important for how they manifest in the gameworld itself.

It's hard to deny how WASP and male roles dominate video games. Cutting this at a different angle isn't about making your main character a darker skin color or having them say "I'm gay" at some point of the game. It's a matter of reevaluating the entire player experience and social dynamics of the game they play in.

>>146237

It's true that they're under-represented. It's certainly not true that they're entirely without representation, as the Arkh Project keeps imputing.

Anyway, they have no design document, no plan, no experience with successful projects, no timeline, no nothing. Just some vague ideas and a dollar figure. At best they're dreamers with good intentions but no idea what they're doing, and any money sent to them is just wasted. At worst they're deliberately scamming people with good intentions out of their money.

>I can't help but see this as a prime example of how indie projects shouldn't be done.
Err, I don't see the logic in this, ever. A few bad cases mean the whole lot is bad? Fuck that mindset.

>>146251

I don't think he was saying ALL indie games are bad. He was saying that this is how you do not go about doing an indie game.

>>146252
Oh, sorry, my mistake.

I can definitely understand the feelings behind this - it fucking sucks to have your favorite media treat like an afterthought at best and horrifically offensive misrepresentation at worst if you're even acknowledged at all - but the way it's being handled is shady as fuck. I can only hope it's a result of zero planning and startling incompetence rather than actual malice.

They haven't even finished a game yet. Not one. And yet they expect a-hundred-fucking-thousand dollars for a game they don't even have the specifics for? A-nope nope nope.

>>146203
>/cog/ > /v/ THANK. YOU.
Pssh, like that's hard to accomplish.

>>146267
We meet the minimum standards of human decency! Woooh better than /v/!

If their idea was to make a sprite or flash type game then I could see this maybe having a chance but as a "3D RPG" I don't see this going anywhere.

>Making a game
>your main selling point is that you are going to make the cast diverse

Nice sentiment and all, but I'm not going to play a game just because of this. And it makes me feel like this game is going to force the fact that the cast is diverse down my throat. Whether or not that's true I don't know, but that's just what it feels like.

>>146271
They should have at least have made a proof of concept before begging for the full cost of the project.

>>146274

The indiegogo description is pretty terrible. There's lots about the driving force behind making it but nothing about the actual game. Is it turn-based? Real-time? Linear? Open world? What should we be expecting here stylistically? What should we be expecting here play-wise? No mention.

Making sure you have entertaining gameplay mechanics should be the #1 priority of any video game you want people to actually play. Look at Mount & Blade, an example of an small, independent video game project done right - it succeeded because the gameplay was fun, and because the gameplay was fun players didn't care about the mediocre graphics. If they're going to make a videogame, they should present us with the outline of the videogame, not just the social justice intentions.

>>146235
Suuuuure it did.

If it's legit, chances are it'll be dissapointing or won't even be made.
If not, sucks to be fooled by a bunch of artwork and big words. There aren't even and screenshots, despite, as of my post, coming out in 25 days.
I smell a scam or failure with no money back.

>>146267
My toilet is better than /v/.
At least my toilet talks about video games.

>>146301
I want to poop in your toilet.

So, where is this fabled concept art at the very least? All I've seen so far are Zuko & Katara of Avatar just chilling up there in OP's post.

>>146303
http://thearkhproject.tumblr.com/

That's pretty much all there is.

>>146304
Ohhhhhh Zuko is a chick! And Asian!

Wow, that is really not clear from the art in the OP.

>>146306
That's not a chick bro.

>>146307
Is Haruka an applicable guy's name?

And I'm pretty sure she is a girl. That or he has a sinfully gorgeous trap-bod.

5 grand? Man, why didn't I think of this? Some bullshit story and a couple of pictures.

>>146310

>>146310
Why would anyone think that would be enough money to kick start a project?

>>146314
It isn't, that money is supposedly going towards character concepts and what not first. Apparently they didn't expect to get that much dough so fast.

So let me get some clarification on this.

So far this arkh project only has a couple pieces of character concept art and a vague idea of a game they'd like to make. Is that accurate?

And do the people on the team currently have any experience in software development and game design? Because if not then this project is already doomed to fail from a business standpoint. 1 out of every 4 software projects are cancelled. Over half of them overshoot their budget and schedule, usually by a fairly large margin. The chances that a small group of people with no real experience in this field will be able to complete a project of this size with all of the features they've promised is something that I honestly don't see working out. I mean the money they've raised thus far is only going to CONCEPT ART. I'm guessing they haven't even touched the mountain of technical and requirements documentation that you need to work through before actual coding starts. If this project is going to actually yield results it will take YEARS. (Even today game titles crafted by fairly large experienced teams take over a year to complete often more) And I highly doubt they'll be able to keep the income flowing for development costs solely on donations for that long.

To me this seems like it's a group "I want to be idea guy for video games!" people. And I can't stand those people.

>>146304
>is looking for another PoC writer.

>We need one more PoC writer to even out the team!

>Writers need to be:

> * Of legal age
>* Able to spend some hours a few days a week working on it
>* Ideally, you have some basic experience in game development/game writing
> * PoC! Queer PoC are a bonus!


>Hiring based on race/gender/sexuality

>>146331
Well one of their main goals outside of making a diverse game is giving jobs to people that are underrepresented in the gaming industry. Granted the gaming industry is more diverse race wise than he is making it out to be.

>>146332
That doesn't stop it from being textbook employment discrimination.

>>146333
I didn't say it wasn't. It is. And this is what they have to say about it

http://thearkhproject.tumblr.com/post/16436834586/cis-straight-white-people-are-trying-to-shut-arkh-down

>>146333
I guess those poor white people being discriminated against are just going to have to dry their tears with all the extra cash they don't deserve and yet still make off of the wage gap because of the color of their skin?

Seriously, acting offended over reverse discrimination is the stupidest shit.

>>146331
>>146333
It is not a problem in this case because it is not systemic.
The majority already has enough opportunities.
Complain again when equality is actually achieved.

>>146335
>extra cash they don't deserve

Wrong direction. It's not that the majority gets something extra, it's that others get screwed out of what they deserve.

>>146335
Reverse discrimination is still discrimination, there's nothing "reverse" about it

>>146334
What the fuck is cis? Do I even want to know?

>>146340
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cisgender

>>146339
What it comes down to is white people bitching and moaning whenever they get the slightest taste of what it's like for everyone else every day every year all the time.

>>146341
Oh, that makes sense. Yeah, fuck this shit. I can see what people were talking about earlier with Riley being a terrible person. Not much reason to get mad except for the people who donated foolishly since the project still won't be going anywhere, but that guy's clearly got some priorities (and it feels like some facts) mixed up.

So are there any GOOD indie game projects on kickstart?

Let him discriminate on who he hires.

I wouldn't want to work for a jerk like him anyways.

This thread makes me want to publish a one-man game out of sheer spite.

>>146346
It can be done. But depending on the size of the project as well as what kind of tools you are using and what skills you have, it would take a LONG time.

The issue with this project is that they seem to want to do a lot with very little actual planning and very little actual funding.

>>146347
>But depending on the size of the project as well as what kind of tools you are using and what skills you have, it would take a LONG time.

Not necessarily. For example I can use Multimedia Fusion 2 and create my own graphics and music to create a small demo in 48 hours. Anyone with a casual knowledge of Ludum Dare would know this kind of setup is fairly common. I can make a slightly bigger demo in weeks, with some more polish/style to impress casual people with money to burn. Then I'll put up a smaller campaign on Indie Go Go or 8-Bit Funding, with a pitch and description to sell people on the game as well as the work-of-concept. Whatever the funding I receive upfront, I can then produce and publish the game for free online.

Within a matter of months I'll have done what a group of social justice bloggers couldn't team up to achieve, without having to rely on affirmative action or white guilt to do it. The only thing I'll need is the constant drive to succeed, achieved by exposing myself to further developments on this infuriating project.

>>146347
>The issue with this project is that they seem to want to do a lot with very little actual planning and very little actual funding.

Speaking of which, does anyone know how BroQuest is coming along?

>>146334
The "Don't let THE MAN bring you down" attitude is what's most suspect about this project. It feels so...demagogic.

>>146344
Not that I know of, but that brings me to a question: Fighting is Magic, an impressive indie game whose development has been going along swimmingly, accepts no donations whatsoever. Can this success be attributed to 1) The use of an existing fighting game engine 2) The existance of already-made canon art 3) The obssessiveness of bronies ?
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Ffeature%3Dplayer_embedded%26v%3D2uYnBcwd4Os&feature=player_embedded&v=2uYnBcwd4Os&gl=US

>>146351
I'd say the use of an existing trademarked franchise, not an existing fighting engine. Companies get touchy about that.

Racism still exists. Don't blame the people whose blogs were linked ITT for being upset about that fact.

>>146342
>>146335
>all white people are rich
>all white people have committed racist actions and deserve "the slightest taste of what it's like for everyone else every day every year all the time."

You funny.

>>146354
The posts you quoted didn't say "all white people". You inserted that quantifier.

You may want to read up on these concepts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Existential_quantification
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_quantification

>>146355
>The posts you quoted didn't say "all white people". You inserted that quantifier.

The posts quoted used the phrase "white people" with no attempt at distinction. If we're supposed to take the hidden meaning of that as "all white people except the ones who aren't according to my tenuous life experience disguised as incontrovertible proof" then he should have said as much instead of using a sweeping generalisation.

>Racism still exists. Don't blame the people whose blogs were linked ITT for being upset about that fact.

Cash grabs are not the way to fight racism in videogames. Accusing people who disagree with your nebulous pitch as 'privileged white straight males' part of a conspiracy to shut down your project is not the way to fight racism in videogames. In fact that kind of e-drama behavior is the perfect way to make it harder to fight racism in videogames in future - your behavior will be the milestone, if not the stereotype, that people will use to measure and denounce future efforts.

What a ruse, this whole thing is terribly political.

>>146356
The meaning wasn't "hidden". The posts were referring to a subset of white people (those who complain about supposed systemic discrimination against them).

The usual >implying shit leads nowhere. Stop it.

Why WOULDN'T people with the attitude described in >>146203 use the __valid criticism (of which there are examples in this thread)__ of the game as a mask for their hatred?

Why should stereotyping perpetrated by the majority be the fault of the TARGET? Especially if the majority is whining about the WORDING and not the CONTENT?

Don't defend idiots.

>>146359
That's a bit hypocritical, considering the idiots are the ones in charge of the project, using employee discrimination to fight against employee discrimination (and not knowing in any way what they're doing with the game in general.) How the hell can you advocate yourself as a major pusher for minority rights and not know shit like that?

You're somehow arguing that it's okay to label any and all dissenters of the game as racist cis's, because it might be true for some of them. That it's okay to be discriminatory and ignorant, because it theoretically fights discrimination and ignorance. How do you not get why this might be stupid or unhelpful in a project based mainly on equality and you know what fuck this

>>146303
CANNOT UNSEE, you bastard.

Also suddenly getting Avatar: The Dawning of Darkness vibes.

>>146359
>The meaning wasn't "hidden". The posts were referring to a subset of white people (those who complain about supposed systemic discrimination against them).

No implication along those lines was made.

>The usual >implying shit leads nowhere. Stop it.

Ironic.

>Why should stereotyping perpetrated by the majority be the fault of the TARGET?

Why should we give money to a vitriolic 'ideas guy' who has no prior experience in indie games or current plan of action, yet is deluded enough to believe their first project will be a triple-A commercial release, and generalises anyone who raises reasonable doubts about their operations as 'cis white straight people no for serious anyone who disagrees with me MUST be straight and white no exceptions' out to put down the poor innocent non-white people who just want to put out a videogame that doesn't conform to THE MAN? Why should we give into guilt-based marketing at its worst?

http://chlorinesea.tumblr.com/post/15336366557/something-about-rockets-so-ive-been-called-a-white
http://chlorinesea.tumblr.com/post/15368276094/something-about-rockets-valbinisticvalbino-something
http://ardeb.tumblr.com/post/17144475360/alright-this-is-a-more-in-depth-post-about-the
http://clitt-tastic.tumblr.com/post/17116402049/reasons-why-i-say-fuck-all-of-you-that-are-boycotting
http://ardeb.tumblr.com/post/17145773881/tw-some-deets-on-riley-the-head-of-the-arkh-project

This is not the kind of PR you want as a videogame developer, much less one trying to make a positive impact in videogames-based multiculturalism. The motivation here seems more like revenge than equality.

>>146359
Maybe some people are tired of being treated like assholes because of the atrocities a bunch of dead idiots they're not related to committed.

Hey, how's this for a bright idea? Let's round up all the Germans alive today, put them in concentration camps, and systematically murder them for what the Nazis did 70 years ago! Hell, while we're at it, let's impale all the Romanians on 20 foot long pikes for what that scoundrel Vlad Tepes did! That'll teach those bastards!

>>146303
THought I was the only one. Cripes.

>>146360
One side has the system working in its favor while the other doesn't. Idealism sure is nice if you're not confronted with the shitty reality pretty much all the time.

I'm stopping this now. My arguments were pretty much entirely recycled from various tumblrs related to this thread and only partially represent my actual opinions. Thank you for playing.

Fun fact: At this point (if not earlier) people who contested the posts I made would have been attacked by multiple named posters and possibly banned had this conversation taken place on /baw/.

>>146365
>puppermaster defense

lol ok

>>146365
>My arguments were pretty much entirely recycled from various tumblrs
...So you can't even defend your viewpoint with your own arguments?
And "One side has the system working in its favor while the other doesn't" just goes right back to >>146354 in terms of making sweeping generalizations.

>>146365
>Idealism sure is nice if you're not confronted with the shitty reality pretty much all the time.

Yeah, it's much better to keep the cycle going.

Fuck ideals, fuck trying to be the better man, fuck live and let live, fuck little children one day living in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character!

My actual opinions:
I agree with the criticism regarding the project brought up in this thread.
I agree that statements that are worded as generalizations should not be used even if no generalization is intended; it is possible that some people may read them as intended, but the assumption that most people will do so is unrealistic since 1. people rarely say exactly what they mean in public and 2. a post on the internet is essentially directed at "anyone who isn't excluded".

I made the previous posts to gauge how political correctness is viewed on this board; I do not want to be banned for saying the "wrong" things. The second spoiler in >>146365 is something I did see happening.

>>146370
>I do not want to be banned for saying the "wrong" things. The second spoiler in >>146365 is something I did see happening.

Um, no.

People said that "reverse discrimination is still a form of discrimination."

They didn't say "DIS IS WHY U DON'T LET FAGS/NIGGERS/WYMIN ON TEH INTERNET".

THAT'S what gets people banned. In fact, it just happened recently on a couple of boards.

>>146372
About a year ago I got attacked (and threatened with a ban) on /baw/ for using the dictionary definition of racism (discrimination based on race) as opposed to the updated one (_systemic_ discrimination based on race). Some people take political correctness _very_ seriously.

>>146374
That seems like a HUGE overreaction.
Well, it does without any context into the actual conversation.

From what I've seen, people get called out or banned if they do something that's obviously racist/sexist/discriminatory (like that wife-beater who kept droning on about how there weren't enough women in cartoons getting brutalized.)

>>146370
>Social experiment
You just admitted that you aren't contributing anything to this conversation. Moving on now.

>>146352
Yeah, completely forgot about that the developers would invite cease and desist orders if they took in any money. Still, I feel that there's some comparison to be made about the development of the two, positive or negative.

>The video game the major companies refuse to give us!

This sounds like the rhetoric George Lucas has been using about why no one wanted to distribute Red Tails.

>>146375
I was just being careful. I already got banned from this board once (before I used a name and for a good reason unrelated to anything in this thread).

I'll shut up now unless I actually have something to contribute.

>>146376
Fighting is Magic is an example of a dedicated team of people with defined roles and skills working within their means to produce something.

The Arkh Project is an example of someone begging for donations to get other people to make their dream game.

>>146377
Oh fuck I watched the Half in the Bag on that earlier..George is so full of shit.

And this games tagline sounds like a similar statement and while I can't name scores of games that had a black or gay protag I can think of a few good ones that had at least the black female or at least minority PC. As for gay..I could swear I've played at least one over the years where that was the case (and not the Nazi H-Game stuff from Japan) though with RPGs having that as an option it makes things difficult when counting. And that is not counting the good games I've played with gay and or minority supporting characters that have been well written and not stereotypical (New Vegas always springing to mind with Ronnie and Arcade)

>Nazi H-Game stuff from Japan
Never expected to see a reference to Absolute Obedience..

>>146331
>"Let's make our game for gay people too, but not white gay people!"
Nigga wat.

>>146347
Wasn't Touhou originally made by one guy? Yes, ZUN, or Junya Ota. Dude has completely made all of those games. Hell, look how that shot off into everywhere on the internet.

>>146349
Pretty well actually. They made a test sample that you can download, though it's awfully buggy/doesn't always work. They've since gone over that though and are working to fix it, after they had an open discussion on what aspects need to be focused on before they attempt another test/alpha. Haven't been as much news from the story/setting content guys, but that's due to most focus being put on fixing code now to make it semi-playable to test.

>>146361
Oh hey, what happened to that?

>>146381
Pretty much.

HELP I'M MY SPECIFIC SOCIAL GROUP ISN'T BEING CATERED ENOUGH TO MATCH MY PERSONAL STANDARDS AND TASTES WHEN IT COMES TO VIDEO GAME PROTAGONISTS!

>>146399
Now now, there is under-representation of people of color (I hate saying PoCs, makes it sound like a virus) and homosexuals in video games.

But this is all sorts of the wrong way to go about it.

vide gams

You're all lying if you wouldn't play an RPG that let you play as an african, native american, chinaman and other minorities against THE MAN and his evil oppressive forces in the early 1700s!

Oh yes, another fine example of how having a "good" cause doesn't make you a good person.

>>146418
I read that as the 1970's.

I'd play an RPG starring the Village People!

>>146431
Wow, that even comes with the bonus of everyone being gay! Quick, send that concept to the Arkh team! They still need help defining their game!

building a character who's primary attribute is their sexual orientation or skin color rarely ends in something other than painfully bad and offensive.
I'm all for a little more diversity when appropriate, but this just screams of wanting something just because "there isn't enough" damned be the consequences or outcome.

Homosexual people don't always share the same opinion on how they should be represented (read: never). I can imagine this ending poorly.

>>146438
Specially if non-homosexual people who believe they know how these groups think are the ones leading this project.

>>146443
Well they're calling them queers in this project, so we're already off to a great start.

>>146418
Flavor it like a Blaxploitation film and I would play the shit out of that game.

>>146445
That's actually the PC term now, though it's usually used as an adjective. It's like how "black people" is more palatable than "blacks."

What if it's an RPG like Pokemon is an RPG.
And your ultimate goal is to get every variety of person onto your party.

>>146459
"Bisexual, use Double-Team!"

Oh wait, no. No, that's not appropriate.

>>146458
Turning former slurs into 'politically correct' terms... classy.

Why are faggots so annoying anyway?

Yeah, we know you are here and gotten used to it

Can you just fuck off and stop trying to be an attention whore already?

>>146464
You're trying too hard.

>>146465
I'm not trying anything

I'm just tired of them making a big deal about this type of bullshit

Tons of other people are discriminated against or simply ignored, stop playing the victim thinking you are the only ones.

>>146459
So would each race/ethnicity and sexual orientation be a type?

>oh hey whats all this abou-
>tumblr social justice: the game

>>146474
Yes, and there are eight Social Clubs that you have to accept as equally valid so you can meet and greet with the Elite Dozen Or So.

>>146474

Your three starters are a Black, Asian and Homosexual.

Black is strong against Asian (being more physically powerful), Asian is Strong Against Homosexual (since they don't oppress it so much as fantasize about it) and Homosexual is strong against Black (Because they're able to make the black feel awkward and uncomfortable).

Look, four joke posts and we already have a stronger concept than Arkh Project.

Five thousand dollars please.

>>146484
We're not quite at their level yet.

We need drawfags.

The irony is that LICD author, arguably the opposite of the PC scale to the people behind this project, has raised more money and fame with his series to the point where a real animated series is made based on his comic, so even the womanizer has gotten more done.

(if he wasn't such a fuckhead with the rights he could actually claim it was his own animated series, but thats for another time)

>>146494
Didn't the animated series made for that bomb so hard it basically killed the company making it, or am I thinking of the CaD cartoon?

>>146496
Unless history has mercifully repeated itself without me noticing, you're describing the CAD cartoon (which was, ironically, produced by Blind Ferret, Ryan Sohmer's company).

>>146462
Taking something that your enemies used to hurt you and reclaiming it for your own purposes nothing new. Hell, the upside-down pink triangle was originally invented by the Nazis as a means of labeling gay men. And in a less related example, every American child is taught how Yankee Doodle was sung by British soldiers to taunt the rebels but became an unofficial anthem for the new country.

You can think it's stupid if you want to, but you're not just looking at the work of some social justice bloggers: it's a time-honored means of coping with oppression.

>>146398
Avatar: Dawning of Dorkness? They gave up a little while after their leader was outed as an ICP lover. I don't know what it is about crazy people that attracts others, maybe it's the energy.

>>146494
Hasn't he been around since forever? I wonder what his early years were like, though I suppose he just stuck with it long enough to accumulate DA-style fans that'll praise and support him no matter what. Same reason why mediocre artists get jobs in the industry; they stick to schedules and deadlines. And yeah, Sohmer lords over that like a smug fuck too.

Speaking of, who's the artist on this thing?

>>146496
Yeah, the CAD cartoon killed Blind Ferret, apparently making HUGE losses. Not hard to see why - Sohmer was asking $12 an episode for stuff that made current Family Guy look like classic Simpsons and had frame skips in the credits sequence. I believe Blind Ferret Studios has died about three times.

The LICD cartoon is still in its infancy; apparently some TV execs are giving it some interest, according to Sohmer.

>>146509
Hmm, that's a pity.
Since I was interested on see their results, regardless of it's terribleness. An ICP lover? As in Insane Clown Posse?

>>146490
Perhaps /draw/ and /co/ can lend us a hand.

>>146477
If you put it in that way...
FFFFFFFFFFFFUCK

>>146496
The LICD cartoon fizzled, and the production shifted into the equally abymal "Dating Guy" IIRC.

And then he apparently decided to make his own cartoon! With Blackjack! And Hookers!

>Anonymous asked: Have you considered revealing some aspects of gameplay a little bit earlier in order to quell some of the anxiety fans have about the project lacking any concrete info on gameplay?

>It’s really difficult to reveal the finalized gameplay in bits, because as we develop new pieces, old stuff will most likely end up changing to better fit the improved idea. So if we reveal something now, and it turns out to change later for any reason, it will look pretty awkward.

Can it be safe to say that this is either a really awful scam, or that the staff has no idea what the fuck they're doing? If they don't know what beta testing or even beta previews are, I have a feeling this project is going to crash and burn.

>>146525
I'd put this in the "no idea what they're doing" camp, because apparently they have tried to make games before.

Never actually released so much as a demo, but they did try.

>>146526
I cant help but think their 'tried to make a game' is the same as mine in that they fired up a program and went "woah I have no idea what the fuck I'm doing, I'm gonna go watch some TV"

>>146525
>Can it be safe to say that this is either a really awful scam, or that the staff has no idea what the fuck they're doing?
Definitely the second thing. Tinkering is fine if you're an amateur just making a game for fun, but with professional games you should really be working from a design document that hammers almost everything out from the start. There might be some slight changes from the initial plan (Peter Molyneaux is infamous for them, for instance), but that should mostly be more in the form of cutting things that didn't work as well as expected rather than adding things that you just realized you could do.

>>146531
Battlelords gave me 500$ for some concept art for a facebook/twitter game. That was about 2 years ago. Status check: Nah it's still not finished. Thanks anyway and good luck.

RPG Maker up in here!

Oh man, just found out about this. All the delightful fun of the tumblr social justice group, with the excitement of "hey I've got this idea for a video game, let's make it without hammering out details". It's possible to come up with projects that promote underrepresented groups; I know /coc/'s been doing that Medieval Lesbians comic for a while.

But even as a lowly intern for a web application and mobile app-making company, I knew the importance of design documents and all that sort of thing. This thing won't go anywhere I'll bet, after the initial rush of attention from all the popular tumblrs reblogging to "signal boost" or whatever.

Of course, as a straight, cis, colorless white man I gotta check my privilege at the door and all that jazz, since I'd assume that any criticism that reached the ears of this project from me would be judged on that basis.

>>146571
>see if it's updated
>nope

Aww.

>>146509
>Speaking of, who's the artist on this thing?
That may be the best/worst part: I just found out that they don't actually have one of their own. All of the stuff we've seen so far was commissioned off of two Chinese artists. That's why they started asking for money so early: to pay for more art.

>>146575
This is a clusterfuck of the most hilarious magnitude.

>>146575
Christ, seriously?

This just gets more and more insane.

>>146575
Maybe they should just write up a script and commission a goddamn comic. At least all that donated dough won't go to waste.

My beef with this game is the same as my beef with western media in regards to race and gender.

That is, it makes a point of it. Think about that for a second. I don't know a single girl or minority that has ever had trouble relating to a white man in a game or a movie, but I've seen a few white people have trouble with relating to minorities. Why is that, you ask? I always thought it had more to do with the idea of what a minority or a woman or a homosexual has to be in society. You see, most 'others' just want to be treated and seen as ordinary people. When people say they have trouble relating to one, what they're really saying is that they can't imagine them having the same thoughts and motivations as they can. And you know what? In games like this, that would be the case, because they go out of their way to make minorities and gays seem different, and unrelatable.

Part of the reason Mass Effect has so much mainstream success is that the character creation aspects forced all the dialogue in the game to be as neutral as possible. It doesn't matter if your character is black or white or asian or gay or female; everyone will more or less treat you with the same level of respect. A rare example is GTA: San Andreas, where the developers went in a very interesting direction when building CJ and the Grove Street Families. A lot of the game's influences were movies like Boyz n the Hood and Menace 2 Society, "hood films" that sought to teach mainstream audiences about life for poor blacks on the west coast in the 80s and 90s. By having an aesop about how different these people were and how differently they lived, it was impossible to relate to them in the same personal level that you could with CJ, or the GTA protagonists before him. It was okay for those movies to do that, because they were made to teach that specific lesson. In games (especially RPGs), relating to your character is the most important thing of all.

I don't see The Arkh Project as having the even-handedness necessary to pull that off.

i'm guessing i must have just imagined the abilty to choose your race and/or the confirmed Confirmed Bachelor/Cherchez La Femme perks when i played New Vegas

>>146580

That's a nice theory but ignores that oppressed minorities are already othered. These sorts of works actually help familiarize, not defamiliarize, because while it may 'make a point' of it, it's still putting the player/audience in the perspective of a sympathetic Other who is motivated by problems and issues they can relate to.

>>146585
So instead of treating minorities like people with equal status we should treat them like people who need to be shoved into a spotlight and told that they're so wonderful and special because they have somehow managed to achieve the sterling accomplishments of existing and being gay/not-white? How else are they ever going to find worth and value if a patronizing group with a paternalistic mindset don't swoop in to save them from a whole fucking lot of nothing?

>>146594
Considering we have and still do treat straight white people like people who need to be shoved into a spotlight and told that they're so wonderful and special because they have somehow managed to achieve the sterling accomplishments of existing and being white and not gay, maybe someone else should get the occasional chance too.

>>146600
No! Bad logic! If it's not right for white people to do certain things, then ethnic/LGBT people shouldn't do the same. And this is one of the things most repugnant about the writing of this project: it's seemingly motivated more out of spite than any sense of altruism.

>>146600
>Considering we have and still do treat straight white people like people who need to be shoved into a spotlight and told that they're so wonderful and special because they have somehow managed to achieve the sterling accomplishments of existing and being white and not gay, maybe someone else should get the occasional chance too.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

>>146594

Don't be dense.The only reason it's considered 'shoving them in' and 'sticking them on a pedestal' is that including them at all is by its very nature countercultural.

>>146511
More people need to see the Ctrl-Alt-Del (Annotated) Animated series.
CAD The Annotated Series - Season 2 Episode 1
Dawning of Darkness, LICD, CAD, Arkh...Failure General time, I guess?

It's also pretty sad how, despite all its claims to be championing various progressive non-traditional things, it's still really vulnerable to being criticized for only being very surface-level in featuring race/gender/etc.
http://sf-drama.livejournal.com/3330212.html?style=mine#cutid1

It's a little like when I was in middle/high school and was amusing myself creating a fantasy constructed world that I touted to my friends as non-traditional, non-Tolkienesque, no elves/dwarves/medieval blah blah. So many unconscious overused tropes of the fantasy genre made their way in, despite my attempts at keeping them out. Even if there was value in what's being created, setting up one's project as being non-conformist in some way puts more pressure to actually be it all the way through.

It's also a damn shame that so many people on Tumblr seem to be forgetting the whole video game side of things. If this was a comic or a story or even an animated thing it would be far easier to whip something up like this. Of course, it's already been done with comics, and it's probably harder to motivate people on Tumblr to pay big bucks for a comic (considering the high number of people on Tumblr who are decent artists... or for that matter are artists at all and not "idea people"). Video games are new, fresh, but so many have no concept of the work that goes into it regarding gameplay and the like.

So all there is are just pictures of characters that people fall in love with and make their own shippy fanart for, because they're "adorbz" "precios bbys".

>>146606
>"Oh great now video games are having miscarriages."

>>146603
>>146602

No, see, bad logic is yet another retread of the constant litany from white people that they get to sit around and enjoy their privilege while minorities must sit around and wait for the world to deign allow them their scraps and never ever try to make something specifically for themselves the way white people do all the time, or else they'll be ~*just as bad as their oppressors*~. Totally just as bad!! despite the whole massive power imbalance, systemic discrimination, and lack of privilege.

Don't get me wrong, this game itself is a disaster in the making running on dream-fumes, but even if it has an incredible premise, an extensive and well-planned design pitch, and a confirmed-for-competent team behind it don't even deny y'all would still be pissed that those uppity minorities dared to have the gall to act like the mighty white straight male was not the most important thing in the room to be catered to at all times.

>>146609
I wouldn't be pissed unless it was still run by loudmouthed assholes.

>>146609
You're a bad poster.

>>146609
GET YOUR TUMBLR OUT OF MY 4CHAN

>>146609
Why is logic so racist?

Hey now!

Trip had a good point, and so did the Anon responding to him. Ideally, you shouldn't have to force minority groups into focus, but the scales are tipped so heavily against them that it can be hard to get anywhere without being aggressive about it. Both methods can be handled with tact and taste, which Arkh seems to lack (among other things).

>>146609
>Don't get me wrong, this game itself is a disaster in the making running on dream-fumes, but even if it has an incredible premise, an extensive and well-planned design pitch, and a confirmed-for-competent team behind it don't even deny y'all would still be pissed that those uppity minorities dared to have the gall to act like the mighty white straight male was not the most important thing in the room to be catered to at all times.

You're making hypothetical scenarios that would never conceivably happen and assumptions about people you've never met solely to satisfy your own moral indignation. In fact you're doing the exact same thing the developers of the game are doing - seeing people who are levying rational criticism at a plan with lots of holes and weaknesses, and replying "NUH UH YOU'RE JUST RACIST THAT'S ALL".

>>146609
I'm denying it. Because that is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. You like to paint the straight white male as this evil overlord, the big scary man in black armor who lives in the castle on Mt Deathblood, because it's easier to feel like you're right when your opponent is evil. It doesn't work that way. You're assuming I wouldn't be backing this project if it was done PROFESSIONALLY because I'm not backing it as it stands now. How is it racist to not throw money at a doomed project? Am I sexist because I'm being smart?

The thing about this project is that anyone who wants to counter the criticism toward it can pull out the racism/sexism card.

BREAKING NEWS!The Arkh project is looking for a new writer, so go on and apply /cog/!
No whites allowed.

>>146616
The issue isn't solely that it demonises white people, it also infantalises minority groups. It's like some self-hating version of the White Man's Burden where they think that minority groups can't possibly possess any agency and so white people need to step in and save the poor minority from the other, evil white man who's keeping him down.

It's just such racist horseshit. It's like, when I was in high school this progressive group got itself in a tizzy about a tourist location because people could come and watch fairy penguins. What's this, they cried? Fairy penguins? FAIRY penguins? Why that's a gay slur, that name must be changed. And they herped and they derped and everything in the region had to change the name on everything because of these fucking morons who promptly set forth giving each other blowjobs and highfives for a job well done.

Then it made the news and it was this whole big thing and people were like, "Seriously, what the fuck? Nobody was insulting gay people at all. What was the entire point of spending all this time and energy on this?" and then the gay community pipes up all like, "What the fuck just happened? Don't look at us. We never asked anyone to do this. We weren't even offended"

It just sticks in my mind as the prime example of why I hate shit like this. They go around calling everybody else oppressive racists because other people refuse to treat minorities like retarded babies. What makes it even worse is that more often than not, the group in question is infringing on minority agency by speaking for them without ever consulting with the minorities in question. They're like the loser who keeps white knighting for the girl who wants nothing to do with him.

Oh, they make me so cross.

>>146624
>Sandra Bullock
>The Blindside

I know that feel.

>>146331
>>146621
The news has been broken.

>>146609
>Don't get me wrong, this game itself is a disaster in the making running on dream-fumes, but even if it has an incredible premise, an extensive and well-planned design pitch, and a confirmed-for-competent team behind it don't even deny y'all would still be pissed that those uppity minorities dared to have the gall to act like the mighty white straight male was not the most important thing in the room to be catered to at all times.

Stereotype harder.

You're addressing everyone reading this thread (targetted audience responds => not derailment) and calling them racist/homophobic based on a hypothetical situation (this is what you're saying, I'm not twisting your words or attacking your language).

Combat rhetoric is not a concept exclusive to the majority. Attacking the logic of your statements equals racism? Are you implying that minorities get to ignore/redefine logic if they want to as long as they're dealing with the majority?

People who try to pass off logical fallacies as valid arguments because "they're RIGHT" can go fuck themselves.

Oh and protip: if you're accusing your opponent of using combat rhetoric, don't do it yourself.

>Edit on 1/25/2012: Thanks so much for every donation, it's you guys who will make Arkh possible. That said, we did not expect to reach our initial goal within only 10 days of starting the campaign. We're therefore setting an unofficial new goal for this particular campaign of 10,000! Don't let the momentum die! Keep donating, keep spreading the word, and keep supporting us until we hit the jackpot!

>>146675
How much does it cost to make a game, again?

>>146679
An AAA title like they're expecting? A lot more than 10,000.

>>146679

Zero dollars if you have the time and the know-how.

>>146683
300,000-400,000 if the double fine numbers are any indicator, though that is for an adventure game.

>>146624
that was Taronga Zoo, wasn't it?

>>146693
Last I checked they were passing the 800,000 mark too which is fan-fucking-tastic.

>>146694
It may have happened there too but I'm a Vicfag. I was thinking of Phillip Island. I still get a little cross when I hear the phrase Little Penguin.

>>146683
Well the Arkh project indiegogo thing is looking to take donations in phases.

>That would run this game approximately $100,000, accounting for the wonderful volunteers who are helping us create this. Depending on volunteer work, we may need as much as $250,000 to provide quality work.

That's nowhere near enough for a AAA quality RPG of any significant length.

I mean if it were really a labor of love kind of game
Would it have been that hard to do the whole thing for free?
I'm sure they could've gotten volunteer work just as easily.

>>146702
Yes. And if they did it on a volunteer basis and allowed white cisgendered straight people to lend a hand then things would be a lot more attainable. (I mean, if you do it all for free on volunteer work it shouldn't matter at that point.)

This game is a wellspring of easymode trolling.

>>146716
no way can I refresh how fast that sucker climbs.

>>146719
A GORILLIAN DOLLARS

LOADS EMONE

>>146716
>that picture

Wait.

This entire fucking game is just a giant excuse to have canonical Zutara, isn't it.

>>146725
Crazy tansgender Zutara
DIAAAAAAAAAAAZ

>>146716

Oh and more stuff dug up on the project lead and various scandalous usage of terms out of favor of the social justice communities:
http://syntheticaudio.tumblr.com/post/17345271203/tw-some-deets-on-riley-the-head-of-the-arkh-project

Live by the sword die by the sword I suppose.

>>146716
>being made by a white male

Being white automatically makes it racist?

>>146716
>New shitty game no one wants to play
Yes, no one wants it, and that's why it not only didn't receive double the requested amount, but was largely ignored and spurned.
Oh wait shit, no.

>>146760
...dude. Did you just fall for that troll image despite the body text almost literally being "This is a troll image?"

>>146716
>>146755
Ahahahahahaahahhaha.

>>146726
Welp. Can't unsee it.

>>146757
This is going to be a HUGE picnic for the Mythical Land of social justice at tumblr.

>>146755
>Makes Jewish jokes and parodies anti black propaganda posters.
>Blatant lies and contradictions.
>The add on the bottom.
It may be too much.

http://imgur.com/a/AJ3vL

This shit just keeps on getting better. Apparently, the person behind this is a self-loathing black girl with an actual honest-to-goodness rage hardon against white people.

>>146770
It's like something out of a Dave Chappelle sketch.

>>146770
Jesus. That's every bit of ideological zombie symptoms right there.

Oh /v/~

>>146736
I repeat. WHY DIDN'T I COME UP WITH THIS????

>>146783
Because, you looked at tumblr and thought they were fools and idiots. You forgot they were fools and idiots with money.

>>146736
actually this reminds be of another Kickstarter Project where walking up stairs is part of the challenge.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1432651738/octodad-2

>>146770
Wait. Wait. That Livejournal name. I knew this person. They used to (still are?) be a regular commentator on bad_rpers_suck, back in my ancient ljrp days. And I always knew her as an absolute asshole, the kind of asshole that could only wish to be a smartass. The kind that would always say loudly and repeatedly how much they didn't care. The kind of asshole that would say how they meant to do that, and they were just pretending to be stupid and you were all just puppets on her strings and other internet cliches.

...Is it common to recognize someone as a wanker, years before they actually hit it big? Because this is, like, the third time for me.

>>146807
What were the other two times?

>My new favorite complaint about Arkh.
>“A few pieces of concept art don’t cost $5000.”
>oh i’m sorry, the artists have only been working 15 days, you see, and they’ve pulled out 12 headshots and 6 full body images with edits, all painterly style which takes a very long time to color, from personal experience
>sry about that guise, i’ll slow down time to make them work faster

Yeah, that's why I'm mad you've made 5k and have only spent it on expensive, finished "concept art."

>>146811
12 headshots and 6 body shots in 15 days is an accomplishment? I take it they've decided not to hire professionals for this.

>>146807
You're like some kind of Internet Wanker Hipster. Hating all the internet wankers before it was popular to do so.

>>146808
The other two instances were very inane (well, this one would be too if it didn't involve one hundred thousand dollars). One person was a little too eager to post page-breakingly huge pictures dumps whenever someone showed tentative interest in picking up a series they liked; this person would later throw a massive hissyfit at the mods of the fanficrants community when they asked her to stop using lolicon icons. The other was self-righteous thread-shitter that later turned out to be a textbook Social Darwinist. Both can be found in the Fandom Wank archives under titles like "Lolicon Wanker" and "Drabble Wank".

>>146726
Oh, I didn't realize that was a woman. I saw the arms and thought "male".

>>146843
Yeah, I thought she was a he and a cross dresser at first, which felt right in tune with the idea they're shooting for. Then I took a closer look and realized that it was a lady.

The tumblr site proclaimed they wanted all "POC" for the dev team, and suggested non-straight folks would be accepted as well.

They posted something about their legal counsel or someone warned them that they were breaking discriminatory hiring practices by writing that and they had to change it, which very much upset the creator; if I remember correctly, she blamed whitey.

Let the irony sink in for a moment.

>>146888
Fuck honkeys! Always trying to keep good games down!

>>146909
Time to make a blackslpoitation video game.

>>146910
You mean a Black Dynamite beat-em-up, right?

>>146912
Fund it. Fund it like the Fist of the North Star.

>>146912
>>146913
It won't do a thing for racism or homophobia, but man it'll have one funky soundtrack.

>>146232

This thread reminded me that HotD: Overkill is in fact a game
I think I'll go purchase a copy of it now

Does Afro Samurai apply here?

Does anyone even remember that it got released?

>>146961
>Does Afro Samurai apply here?
Of course not!
It's an exception to the rule and thus should be ignored in order to further the agenda.

>zanehatestomatoes asked: I'm kind of interested in a discussion about the post that ended with: "And the two white people in the game are the tokens. And they play their token role quite well, I think!" I'm just curious, because this sounds like a "bullying-the-bully" mentality which isn't always the most conducive to change or what you guys sound like you're trying to do. Are you sure the best idea is to turn the tables so much that you lose the idea of equal representation you were searching for to begin with?

>I’m sorry, it seems that you had the idea that this was about equal representation in itself. No no, sorry. It’s about equalizing this game with all the other games on the market which are distinctly and primarily tokenizing, fetishizing, and unequal. :)
=======================================
>nathandrakeismylover asked: I was all down with a queer-inclusive game for people of all races, genders, orientations, creeds, etc. But your response to zanehatestomatoes caught me by surprise. It looks like you intend to marginalize (white) folks based on their identities. That's not inclusive at all. If ARKH is not about equal representation, I'll keep looking for a game that is.


>Nowhere do we say Arkh is inclusive of ALL races, genders, orientations and creeds. It says it has a focus on queer identities and people of color, two groups that get little to zero representation in any other game. If you want to see white and straight people, play any of the other million games on the market. If you want to see mostly white people and a couple of token queers and PoC, again, there are several of those games on the market.

>Your issue seems to be that you are upset that white and straight people will be the minority, the tokens, the minor characters, for the first time ever in their entire lives, and frankly, that’s quite racist of you, and this game is not here for your enjoyment, or the enjoyment of anyone who thinks like you, anyway.

>And the entire idea that you think white people can be marginalized based on their being white pretty much makes your white supremacist ideologies clear.

>Now have a lovely day.
=================================
>zanehatestomatoes asked: I in no way was requesting the white characters needed to have a major role, I was just wary of the idea of tokenism at all. Based on your later posts, we have different definitions of "token", mine being a character placed solely to pander to that group without serving a real purpose to the story, rather than it just meaning "minor". I am wholeheartedly in support of balancing out what characters are included in mainstream gaming, but language creating sides just exacerbates the problem.

>There are sides here. You are either for the stopping of oppression, or you aren’t. It’s as simple as that. Neutrality doesn’t exist for PoC, and I’m not going to let white people get away with the idea that it does.

===============================

and because I don't want to just wall of text all of this here is a link to the next part

http://thearkhproject.tumblr.com/post/15326734037/im-offended-to-be-referred-to-as-racist-now-when

Not making themselves look real good.

Is it just me or does their argument resemble the argument fox news gives to justify calling themselves fair and balanced?

>"Well yeah we have a big conservative bias, but we can still call ourselves fair and balanced because we're just counteracting the big liberal bias in the rest of the media!"

>>147100
>>There are sides here. You are either for the stopping of oppression, or you aren’t.

How ironic, the argument she's making is black-or-white. Pity I can't find the button to post a quick message like '"If you support racist ideologies, you’re racist." Glad to hear you're owning up for your behavior! :)'

Anyway, quick dumb question - indie games. Do threads for those go in /cog/ since they're games, or /coc/ since they're long-term projects?

>>147102
/cog/ unless you are making a /co/ related game yourself and want to make a thread to post progress reports and stuff.

>>147100
That's so ablist.

I just don't understand what the desired end result is of all of this. Simply turning the tables and going eye-for-an-eye on things like tokenism isn't going to help relations with mainstream elements of society, it'll just further marginalize disadvantaged groups. If they're just going for a masturbatory circlejerk for PoC and all that to say "OK we have our own game," then OK, but going in with the approach of "historically dominating groups can never be poorly treated and if they are it's completely justified because this is apparently a war" then it's not going to do anything for their cause.

If anything it's just a further excuse for mainstream game companies to point to things like Arkh and say "why do we need to include marginalized groups? They have their own indie games, and from the look of this Arkh thing, if we go this direction we are actively alienating the majority of our paying customers." It's of course an incorrect notion that bringing in more diversity and variety in video games means being somehow anti-white or anti-straight or anything like that (like that one ludicrous poster on the Bioware forums complaining about the option of same-sex romance in DA2, that got some press) -- but it's like Arkh is trying its damnedest to reinforce that notion.

Oh and that dress in the concept art was so original.

>>147121
>I just don't understand what the desired end result is of all of this.

The desired end result is for people to give them money so that they can pay outside sources to do the work for them so the person running it can have their dream game made. That's it.

All the rest of this crap is because the person running this is a self-righteous jackass.

>browsing the arkh blog earlier because while the creator is a cunt, the art is pretty damn nice
>"hey we're gonna completely change that red dress' torso"
>oh hey that's weird i wonder wh--
>>147125
ah

>>147125
Who gives a fuck if it copied off of this. The art is still beautiful

>>147245
Looks a lot less vibrant then the real deal.

>>146910
Fighting a giant Rainbow Colored Pigmeat Markham "DA JUDGE" while he tries to smack you down with his gavel as a possible boss?

How has SA's minority gaming thread reacted to this?

So she wants to make a video game based on Minoriteam...

>>147265
If it was a Minoriteam game, I would throw my money at that.

>>147282
How many games actually feature middle-aged men, though?
They don't usually go past late twenties or early thirties.

And I mean there are a lot of games that let you pay as crazy shit like a dinosaur or a potty-mouthed squirrel. Does Arkh Project let you play as a dinosaur?

>>147282
>videogames that star middle-aged white men

>>147284
MGS series
Splinter Cell
Some GTA games
Assassin's Creed 2.2 or whatever it's called
Modern Warfare
Chris is 35 in RE5 He'll be like 37 in RE6

>>147284
>And I mean there are a lot of games that let you pay as crazy shit like a dinosaur or a potty-mouthed squirrel.
...which are usually modeled after and/or voiced by white guys. Just sayin'.

Pardon me if I'm getting repetitive guys, but the sentiment "let's make a game where most of the cast isn't white and/or straight" isn't a bad one. The game would need to have more going for it than just that, of course, but even if it was lacking in that department it still wouldn't be worth actively trying to stop.

These are what make The Arkh Project truly bad:

1. They're just a bunch of people with ideas, and yet they're already accepting a whole lot of donation money from people who might see nothing in return.
2. The person behind it is a spiteful, insensitive, close-minded jerk; in other words, the last person you want representing the social justice movement.
3. Some of the ideas that they've put forward so far aren't actually that progressive, and a few (like presenting mental illness as a superpower that makes you hurt people) are very backwards and counter-productive.

There are probably twice as many additional points, like the poor choice of character designs and turning down potential help on the basis of ethnicity, but those three are the damning factors.

>>147284
No game for old men, except maybe games by Paradox Interactive - and even that is a stereotype that ALL OLD PEOPLE LOVE HISTORY.

>>147288
>voiced by white guys

Sonic was voiced by a White guy.

Keith David.

>>147287
37 isn't really middle aged...

>>147293
Eh. Close enough I'd say. Life expectancy for men sat around 76-78 for a good long while.

http://kineticliterature.com/why-you-shouldnt-make-make-a-game/
Someone linked me this and I immediately thought "man someone needs to show this to the arkh project's creator..."

A VN would be a waaaay better idea.

>>147303
On a side note, is Python a good place to start learning programming?

>>147303
Because they can make the very sound rebuttle of "who the fuck would buy this shit outside of japan or maybe china".

>>147313
Really, any programming language is as good a place as any. You might do slightly better learning a C-based language (C++, Java, or C#) for the same reason a polyglot might want to learn a romance language first, but really once you know how to program in one language, learning a new programming language can be done over the course of a weekend. It used to be harder before Google, but these days syntax and thinking like a machine is really the only thing you have to learn to be able to program in any programming language.

>>147317
And then the fanbase can make the rebuttle "but you have only 5k and no developing experience. Hell, you're relying on an artist giving you discount prices just to get basic models done." Also that wasn't a question so what's with the because?

>>147313
Python is certainly an easy language to start out with as long as performance isn't too big of a deal.

>>147317
PROTIP: No one is going to buy the bad fantasy novel you paid some desperate artists and programmers who are apparently not experienced enough to know what they're worth $100 each to turn into a video game for you, either.

As they pointed out, decent programmers are probably going to expect quite a lot money. Shitty ones less so, but even they aren't going to work on your project for cheap--they've got their own hopeless projects to work on if they're not getting paid anyway.

And decent artists are way even more expensive than that, unless you take advantage of a naive artist who hasn't learned what he's worth or how to protect himself legally for it. For starters, art done for someone else's video game is almost certainly going to be Work-for-Hire. Which means an artist who knows what that means is likely going to charge you ten times as much as he would for a one-off commission that he still owned--and they're owed that much. Look at what just happened to the guy who helped create Ghost Rider because he did Work for Hire at the same rate he would've done for regular work. So you're probably looking at $1000 a drawing from an artist who knows what he's getting himself into.

Also? Artists, like programmers, have their own projects they'd rather be working on. A one-off commission is one thing, but if you're going to be taking up a big chunk of their time, they're going to raise the prices because you're keeping them from what they love.

And that's just for concept art. Once you start talking the production of assets, prices are going to get even higher--3D models take more time than even the most detailed single drawing, and rigging the bones and deformers on them is hard work if you don't want that carefully sculpted model to melt into a crawling horror once it starts to move. You're looking at a lot more than $1000 for a 3D model. Sprites are cheaper, but for modern games, with sprites there's often more meticulous animation needed than with 3D models--with models, you can just move the bones into new positions if you need a new animation. That takes time and I'm not belittling the effort involved, but with 2D animation each frame is going to have to be drawn from scratch--so you're not looking at a HUGE savings unless you're dropping down to SNES-quality graphics.

Point is: you probably don't want to make a game unless you've already got a lot of this shit covered, and especially unless you've got an idea that actually translates to "game" rather than "story." The writer is easily the least important person in a game's staff, no matter what genre you're talking about, so if all you've got is a story idea you should really be applying to work on someone else's game, or (like the article suggested) work on a visual novel.

Or you know what? Work on a regular novel. Use the skills you've got.

"Game ideas" that are worth developing aren't "A young boy from Earth discovers he's the heir to the throne on an alien planet, and must save his people from the invaders who are trying to take their home--HUMANS FROM EARTH!" They're gameplay concepts like "Using procedural generation of crops and livestock, this game puts the player in the role of a farmer who must breed and hybridize his stock to create THE TASTIEST OF ALL FOODS. And I guess for story....um....maybe he'll get kicked to death by gluttonous ninjas if he doesn't pull it off in five years? Or something like that. No, don't hire a writer, just ask all the programmers for ideas and see what sticks."

>>147321
As the dick behind this wants an AAA game and no one outside of a few fringe anime lovers and Asian niche markets enjoy VNs, using that sort of tactic is obviously what white straights want Arkh to lower it to.
They don't even have good writers, which any good text heavy project needs for anyone to stay and click several hundred times. Now this sort of hopeless change in an already tainted goal, combined with the fact that you're trying to tell them to essentially lower their expectations to the floor by using something as “easy” as a VN leaves me wondering just how loud the one idea person is going to say "fuck you".

This internet drama is DELICIOUS

>>147313
Are you currently enrolled in a university?

If so, get your hands on a copy of MATLAB. The documentation is excellent; the syntax is simple and straightforward; the development environment makes it super easy to keep track of variables, types, and command history; it's really easy to learn; and there's some good books and tutorials out there.

The catch is that nobody outside of engineering and the sciences uses MATLAB, but that's okay. You don't want to become an expert, you just want to get a handle on the basic tools and get an intuition for writing and solving problems with code. Those are cross-language skills.

>>147327
>"Game ideas" that are worth developing aren't "A young boy from Earth discovers he's the heir to the throne on an alien planet, and must save his people from the invaders who are trying to take their home--HUMANS FROM EARTH!" They're gameplay concepts like "Using procedural generation of crops and livestock, this game puts the player in the role of a farmer who must breed and hybridize his stock to create THE TASTIEST OF ALL FOODS. And I guess for story....um....maybe he'll get kicked to death by gluttonous ninjas if he doesn't pull it off in five years? Or something like that. No, don't hire a writer, just ask all the programmers for ideas and see what sticks."

I don't suppose there's a happy middle ground between both of these? One of the defining characteristics of video game storytelling is that it's almost universally terrible. Maybe developers could start with a central gameplay concept and hire a professional writer to pad it out later (like what happened with Half-Life)? Or maybe fuse the approaches like with Dear Esther, where the entire focus is on using gameplay mechanics to enhance a story's atmosphere?

Just sayin', I mean it's not this bozo's much interested in story either beyond how it humiliates the white man.

>>147342
Of course story can be well done, and writing CAN be a part of the process. But the only way to make writing the core of the game is to marry it completely with gameplay: Silent Hill has brilliant writing, but it depends entirely on the actual game and actions of the player to portray that.

>>147342
Yeah, but the point is that an idea for a story is not an idea for a game, if you see what I'm saying. I was being a little dismissive by saying the story should be an afterthought, but I do stand by the point that if you come up with a story and try to shoehorn interactivity into it, you're going to make something unplayable.

>>147346
>if you come up with a story and try to shoehorn interactivity into it, you're going to make something unplayable.

A-fucking-men to that.

>if you come up with a story and try to shoehorn interactivity into it, you're going to make something unplayable.
Sup MGS4?

>>147263

Mostly just comments about how interesting and nice to see more glbt/poc stuff, but gonna fail due to how unfeasible it is to make an AAA game on $100000, this was when Arkh was first making the rounds though.

Later on when people found out about Riley and her lj/tumblr, it became, interesting and nice to see more glbt/poc stuff, but ugh what an awful person and yeah, it's gonna fail.

>>147293
No. You're right. Kinda close though and older than usual for game protags. But considering the decline you have physically post 30 and the cut off age of enlistment being at 42. It's kind of up there.

NIER and Syphon Filter were also some other games starring older men

I can't even think of one game headlined by a middle aged woman.

>>147400
NIER is only MANLY in the western version, the jap version has you playing a bishie teen who wants to fuck his little sister

Speaking of that game was anyone else completly blindsided when they found out Kainé had a penis?

>>147401
Japan has an obsession with youth, and unfortunately the negative effects of their past dominance in video games have only recently begun to unwind like No old people, or in more extreme cases ALL ADULTS ARE EVIL tropes that became the norm in the JRPG age. I think the only active old person over 40 I can think of is Sam Fisher or The Boss and even that is kind of falling into stereotypes. Although it could be worse, like the lecherous grandpa or the by-the-book Kung Fu masters. But it is still sad that people are almost afraid of having a protagonist or main character that is anywhere beyond their late teens and especially so if it’s a woman.

>>147404

I think that has to do with the belief that the demographic of people playing those games are going to be pubescent males, so the main character(s) should be the same age. Complaining that video games marketed towards 12-year old-boys have 12-year-old boy characters is as silly as saying the same thing about the shounen genre as a whole.

Perhaps there are adults and girls playing video games nowadays, but Japan's perception of world trends might just be lagging a bit. It's just where the money is, they figure.

>>147404
Youth being a good thing is almost common in most cultures. And the West is just as guilty as having young protags. Sure you have exceptions but it's not like Japan doesn't have its exceptions either.

>>147403
They discussed it alot in press releases

>>147342
>Maybe developers could start with a central gameplay concept and hire a professional writer to pad it out later (like what happened with Half-Life)? Or maybe fuse the approaches like with Dear Esther, where the entire focus is on using gameplay mechanics to enhance a story's atmosphere?
That is done, but it's done as an afterthought. A company decides to do a superhero MMO, negotiates with DC to get the license and gets a working game going. Once they've done all that THEN they have someone do the the bits about Lex Luthor and Time Travel, because that's the easy part.
And it's also necessary to do it that way from the story perspective. Video Games are a distinct medium, and the requirements of that medium are different.
Take Mass Effect, usually held up as an example of good video game story telling. By the standards of a movie or novel, the pacing is terrible. WAAAY too long opening section, a middle part that has no idea where it's going, and then a bunch of stuff crammed together at the end.
But this is because video games (of any length) will suffer from irregular pacing, because you're not going to sit through the whole game in one sitting. So a standard movie story arc gets screwed up because you stopped the movie one day, didn't pick it up again for a week, and picked up right there.
Video games, like monthly comics, need a jumpy story because you're going to be picking it up and stopping it quickly. That means I shouldn't have to go more then 30 minutes or so without something new catching my attention, and something getting resolved.
The writing has to fit the confines of the game it's working on, which is why the writing has to be an afterthought.

>>147447
>But this is because video games (of any length) will suffer from irregular pacing, because you're not going to sit through the whole game in one sitting. So a standard movie story arc gets screwed up because you stopped the movie one day, didn't pick it up again for a week, and picked up right there.

This isn't a story-telling characteristic unique to video games, though. Episodic television follows this pattern as well (though there are arcs inside the episodes that don't exactly tally). I think a better way to approach video game story might be to treat it like a series boxset rather than this massive cinematic motion picture. It might help cool developer's egos too.

>>147458
>This isn't a story-telling characteristic unique to video games, though. Episodic television follows this pattern as well (though there are arcs inside the episodes that don't exactly tally). I think a better way to approach video game story might be to treat it like a series boxset rather than this massive cinematic motion picture. It might help cool developer's egos too.

I'm glad you posted this because it's given me pause to consider the parallels in narrative between individual video games and TV seasons - the pilot, the splashy series beginning and introduction sequence that had the most budget poured into it, the self-contained episodes, with a cliffhanger or big finish to end things with. It's also made me think once again of shows like Samurai Jack that played with the audience's perception of events - e.g. episodes playing out from the antagonist's point of view, or fights based around strategic use of sunlight and shade - and how we don't get many games where the player takes control of the 'evil' side of the battle (comic relief baddy or otherwise), or uses multiple independent protagonists to fight a recurring foe.

>>147334
Now she's threatening legal action for "libel."

I honestly think she has legit brain problems and should use all that scammed money to find a good shrink.

Doesn't stop any of this from being hilarious, though.

>>147467
That or she is perpetually in this teenage rage that hates anything that doesn't do exactly as she wants.

>>147472
Since she's apparently in her late 20s, that seriously screams of personality disorder.

So same difference.

>>147467
Who the hell would she even sue for libel!? the internet?? i don't understand

>>147477
I wouldn't put it past her to try and literally sue The Man.

>>147480
That would be kind of magnificent, conceptually, if this wasn't so pathetic.

>>147477
>>147480
>the internet?
>the man?

The Man behind The Internet

>>147482
That and she's probably too young to even know what that means.

http://thearkhproject.tumblr.com/post/17974404488/the-current-arkh-team

They're doing a neverwinter nights mod.

5000$ for a neverwinter nights mod.

>>147568
There are no words.

>>147568
Like... Neverwinter Nights 1? Not even the second one?

Buh?

>>147568
REALLY? NEVERWINTER NIGHTS?

My fucking dad made bigger projects than what they are doing in NWN on his own and he didn't get paid jack shit for it.

If I was them I would just get the inevitable out of the way and shut down the tumblr while disappearing off the internet.

>>147571
Well you need several thousand to get people to remember how to use an almost 10 year game as the basis for some loon's magnum opus. She wanted to pick the whitest, heteronormative game to stick it to people and that would obviously be something inspired by DnD and had no shifting skin tone -- unlike neverwinter nights 2.

>>147568
Okay.
If they didn't do the whole donations 5000 dollars thing? This might be actually kind of a good idea. I mean, fuck, at least its more likely.

>>147575

Yea. Before it sounded like they wanted to attempt some kind of Skyrim level magnum opus RP that could've been released. Now it's something that they could theoretically accomplish, it's just that it now completely invalidates all the money thrown at them.

I mean fuck, did Katawa Shoujo get donations? (I'm not saying that rhetorically. I'm actually asking if they got donations)

>>147576
They went from too big of a project to too small of one.

Also from the Katawa Shoujo FAQ
>Q: I want to donate to Four Leaf Studios. How can I do this?
>A: We will not be accepting donations for a variety of reasons. Instead, please donate to a charity of your choice; they need it a lot more than we do.

Neverwinter Nights? I can understand modding an existing product as a test bed because it's largely similar to or contains functionality that'd work in another game, but the Aurora engine is one of the most unstable pieces of crap they could have picked. If they were looking to use an old-ass engine, they could have picked Dungeon Siege instead.

They also don't have a single 3D artist on their team.

>>147579
Well.. TECHNICALLY? The project leader has this supposed 3d artist they want to hire once they get enough money. (It's one of the biggest reasons for their budget.) But I mean, they haven't specified who it is or shown any samples of the artist's work.

>>147580
That sounds almost semi-reasonable until you realize all they will do is beg for donations to basically commission someone as a mercenary.

>>147577

Well there you go.

People who make a Visual Novel online to help establish the value and equality of disabled people > People who make games online to help establish the value and equality of different races and sexes.

>>147581
>>147580

Not to mention there's practically nothing saying this guy will accept even if they come up with the cash.

If they wanted someobody's help they should've just ASKED FOR HELP and if he accepts then they can go from there and see if they can get up more interest in having a working alpha of some sort, and if he declines then they can just move onto someone else and see if anyone else is interested.

This whole team is just... amateurish in the worst possible way.

>For one of their million year anniversaries, Ain was gifted a Fourth Level human playmate, Haruka. They slowly fell in love, but their relationship was forbidden. Jerah caught them and had Haruka arrested. Since Ain's father was the judge in the trial, Haruka was sentenced to the highest punishment in both the corporeal and astral realms; the Anima Fracta ritual, or soul shattering ritual, a ritual that forced one several millions of years behind in growth, with little to no memory of any portion of their life cycles so far, until all the shattered pieces were regained, which would take entire eras to complete.

>To save Haruka from that ritual, they agreed to shed their forms together, and Ain was to carry Haruka's uncontrolled ethereal form to a new place where they could live happily together.

>Unfortunately, Ain is still a young Arkh and had never travelled alone in ethereal form, so they were separated and Haruka was sorted into a world without Ain's input. Ain, devastated, blindly followed suit without remembering to transfer the proper memories or proper knowledge of how to reincarnate, and damaged her ethereal energy...

>And that is how the story begins...Ain must learn how to maneuver her memory, and the Anima Crebro Prognata, or Astral Reincarnation System (ARS), to fix the damage, remember her cause, and find a place to live happily ever after with Haruka.

>>147588
So we don't even actually have a Transgendered person in this story. We're getting fantasy ersatz transgendered person, someone who's in the wrong body because of magical bullshit.

I think I could make a better, more compelling NWN2 mod with this simple concept.
"A NWN2 module where you are a transgendered person. Since this is D&D, you set off on a quest to find a wizard to magic you into a new body."
Focus would be on character interaction, how people react to your quest etc. Gotta find a wizard, get a big pile of money for your gender reassignment spell.

>>147594
But....actual transgendered people are wiiiiiiiierd.... You racist.

The transgendered arn't a race. They are a species.

>>147594
But if they didn't include all the magical bullshit, how else would you see that their love is so pure that it can transcend spacetime and the physical realm and the actual fucking point of the project?

>So we don't even actually have a Transgendered person in this story. We're getting fantasy ersatz transgendered person, someone who's in the wrong body because of magical bullshit.

So it's like 90% of genderbending/futanari hentai.

>>147624
So we have a jillion video games with this level of representation of Transgendered people, and they all come from Japan.

>>147625
Which is almost fitting given that the whole thing is set-up as a wannabe JRPG. I mean, just look at that Final Fantasy-esque dog Latin up there.

>>147625
That are still somehow both homoerotic and homophobic.

>So we don't even actually have a Transgendered person in this story. We're getting fantasy ersatz transgendered person, someone who's in the wrong body because of magical bullshit.

It's kinda funny, cause there's websites out there with many, many thousands of user-submitted, novella-length porn stories with almost that exact premise.

>>147640
And an actual Comic of that sort as well. Eternal Warrior stuck in the body of a woman having to live (and love) as a woman.

>>147648
That still sounds dumb.

http://thearkhproject.wikispaces.com/Gameplay
When you read it, you realize they haven't actually written a single thing about gameplay. They haven't thought about game mechanics. At all.

>>147648
>Nipple highlights
what, I
what is this and where the hell is their pelvis

>>147745
>The player can also marginally control Ain's two travelling companions, currently named Vishal and Neelu.

Can't leave without my buddy Superfly.

>>147745
>Ain is 16 million years old, which is considered in the mid-teenaged years of an Arkh's life.
>16 million years old
>young
Jeeeeeeeeesus whaaaaaaaaaaaaat
16 million!? Wouldn't someone that age be practically omnipotent at that point?

>>147745
>From the beginning of the game to the end, the MC will get weaker and weaker, forcing the player to be very careful in deciding what to do.

>Game Features
>3. Ability system that requires you power down with each level, instead of powering UP.

what.

>>147745
Looking through the articles...is it proper to use singular "they" with transgendered individuals?

>>147763

Makes grinding detrimental to the player, the game becomes harder later on. The main character could start off with a vast selection of abilities, only to gradually lose those abilities, turning the fights from 'eh, spam Armageddon/favourite spell' to 'oh fuck I'm left with these shitty spells, need to use stragedy to succeed'. Seems interesting in theory - a bit like Nuzlocke where you learn to appreciate the choices you wouldn't normally make.

>>147767
it seems interesting all right

it doesn't seem fun

>>147763
>>147762
Is this fantasy or science fiction?

>>147766
It depends on the person's preferred pronoun.

Originally Haruka and Ain were apparently supposed to be a cis straight couple until "Riley" found LGBTQ and decided to queer them up. Now they're both genderqueer and some folks who identify as such use "they" as a pronoun. But the authors can't seem to keep it consistent and you'll find a lot of "she"s mixed in there.

Kinda jumping on this thread to ask a question of you guys here, since /v/ moves way too fast and I can't get a good hold of them)

If there was a game with a large or near-total minority presence, what would you like to see? Would you be interested in the game at all?

I'm currently designing/plotting a game set in the 1300's, an AU steampunk & magic Africa and a world where the Silk Road is still thriving. You would be able to have your choice of several different characters, either African, Asian, or Arabic.

In the game, Europe would have been devastated by a ritual gone wrong, where some demon lord was accidentally called out of Hell by a witch. Witch died, demons rampaged across Europe, slaying everyone and everything that got in their path. The good folks at the borders of Europe saw what would happen if those demons then invaded their countries and so sealed off the continent from the rest of the world for 300 years, before breaking apart the MacGuffin and hiding the pieces somewhere, since someone could also use it to break the barrier down entirely.

Your task as the PC is to explore the lands looking for these pieces in order to either repair the border or destroy it, while also trying to maneuver your way through 4 different factions who are all rivals to each other and vying for control over Africa. You have access to various types of magics (like Voodoo, Islamic or Daoist magic) or Asian-developed steampunk weapons, or a regular and culturally significant weapon. You also fight monsters such as Chinese zombies, djinni, ghuls, giant crocodiles/spiders...

The concept is simplistic, frankly, but I think it would be very awesome to have a game that is not Euro-centric but something that focuses on other cultures, which can be quite interesting in their own right.

>>147785
I gotta say that that sounds really cool. It would of course all depend on the gameplay, but the concept sounds great. I'd love to see something with that sort of setting. The notion of focusing on the Silk Road is cool, because often the whole "Asia Minor" area of the world gets ignored, because I know some people see "West" (Greece, Rome, European civilization) and "East" (China, Japan, India) in the world and in between ends up a muddy middle. It's one of the disservices of a lot of our history books.

When doing research for that sort of thing, I'd recommend reading (if you haven't already read) "The Years of Rice and Salt," an alternate history novel where just about everyone in Europe gets wiped out by the Black Death instead of one-third. Also, "Avatar: The Last Airbender" did a good job of showing a non-Western fantasy world.

>>147785
As far as the setting goes, this sounds ace. I'm interested in hearing more about the gameplay and actual story, however, and how the culture is reflected in this.

Just as an example, if you've ever watched Extra Credits, they spend one episode discussing 'The Myth of the Gun'. I'd recommend watching it yourself rather than going on my explanation, but the basic idea is that Western games tend to view weapons as a tool any man can pick up and use to enforce his will, following the legend of the Cowboy, and Eastern games tend to view weapons as an extension of the inner self, following the legend of disciplined warriors like the Samurai.

Ever since I watched that video, I've wondered what other regions' 'Myth of the Gun' would be. What their philosophy behind weapons are, and what their ideal hero looks like.

I'm not sure where one would even begin to research this, though.

>>147767
It sort of has precedent with rougelikes like Nethack, where the enemies are horribly balanced with your level. After too many level-ups, it gets to the point where you literally can't beat your enemies and you have to crafty and use ways to kill/avoid/trick enemies that don't give you experience.

>>147817
>>147800
Thanks for the advice and the research aids, guys. I'm still working on fleshing it out, and anything like this is pretty helpful.

As for gameplay mechanics, well...for one thing, one would be able to move using the wasd keys or the mouse. The game would be in 2d, and any battles are side-view and turn-based, since I don't hold any delusions about making this game an "AAA" type game. Enemies are encounterable across the landscape, not invisible to the player as with Pokemon games.

Any "special" combat moves are unlocked from a skill tree. The two types of combat fall into 2 sets: 'Physical' and 'Magical'. 'Magical' packs far more punch, but much of it requires preparation beforehand. (For example, the sangoma would need to craft a powder beforehand that she can throw into the eyes of a bandit in order to blind and cripple him. Another person would need to craft a potion that could call an ifrit to him. ect.)

Steampunk weaponry falls into the Physical category (but gets its own branch), and is used primarily by Asians. Many Asians at this point have had themselves partially modified (I have a companion concept for a young Chinese engineer with a mechanical armcannon and a mechadendrite) and have integrated these into their culture completely.

There are 6 main stats, Strength, Willpower, Intelligence, Luck, Agility and Personality. Strength features into physical combat and is factored into your max health, Agility into how fast you move on land and if you could strike first, Willpower determines how quickly you regenerate health and mana, Intelligence determines the power of your magic and factors into how much of it you have, and Personality improves your reputation (which is something pretty important in game.)

There are various things the PC can do around the landscape, such as collect herbs, trade between the major cities using camels and chests, discover wrecked caravans (which may or may not be set up as traps), help villagers out, ect. Quests range from simplistic ("Help me find my chickens!" to relatively complex. "Can you assassinate this official for me? He's getting in the way.")

blah blah blah. There's other shit that I hope to incorporate into this, but at this point I'm probably derailing.

So, no one's going to wear pants, huh? Okay.

These infodumps biographies are painfully hilarious. All they would need is a favorite food and blood type, and they would read like character biographies scribbed into the margins of a shoujo manga.

So we're autosaging.

...Does anyone want a new thread?

>>147832
Dem disproportionately long legs.

These character designs are so deep and different from other JRPGs.

>>147833
Yes, but that's because I'm a terrible person who thinks this is hilarious. Additionally, it's a beautiful example of "what not to do when you want to make your own game".

>>147850
I didn't know they were making a VN about Prince's backup musicians.

>>147845
Apparently they're supposed to be the younger sibling of the protagonist, despite being drawn a good foot or two taller than her.

>the past few posts.
wat